UFOs - Have They Always Been Here?

Show Transcript

With modern UFO cases, it's easy to say that they could be manmade. But what about the UFO sightings that predate the Wright brothers' first airplane back in 1903, or that predate the first hot air balloon in 1783? We'll be covering those exact cases. many of which I doubt you've ever heard of. Hello and welcome to this episode of Mysteries with a History. (00:37) We will be taken on a wild ride into the unknown, the strange, and the mysterious. Like you, I have questions, and like you, I want answers. And with each episode together, we will peel away the layers to look for the truth. This show is going to be really exciting just because we have a huge timeline of cases to cover, and I simply cannot do it alone. (00:59) So let me bring in my co-host, Jimmy Church of Faded Black Radio. Jimmy, happy Thursday. How you doing? Happy Thursday to you. Hello, everyone. What a great show coming up here. And I do have to ask, what brought this one on? It's such a fascinating subject, you know, to go back in time before, you know, modern technology. (01:27) But what's going on? What caused this week's show? The past is just as important as the present. And in modern times, with all the technology that we have, with the CGI that we have now, with the advancement of AI, it's very easy to brush off more modern UFO sightings as any of those. But it's more difficult to do that when we are looking... (01:51) towards history that go prior to 1903 and farther than that as well, just like with the hot air balloon in 1783. So it's really interesting to see what we can come across. And shockingly enough, there's a lot of cases, some of them that people are familiar with. But I think there's going to be a lot of cases today that people will say, what? I've never heard of that. (02:17) How come I've never heard of that? All I hear about is Roswell. Well, we're going to change that for you. Yes, exactly. The more that I look at the phenomenon itself, I am so interested in not only pre-1947, pre-Roswell, what was going on out there, pre-Kenneth Arnold, and when the word flying saucer entered into popular culture. (02:51) you back up before that and then, you know, no, push it back further before there was something artificial in the sky. You had birds, you had bees, right? You had things flying that were natural, but things that were described in an unnatural way that shouldn't be in the sky before 1903, before the Wright brothers, before hot air balloons and, and, and people, Jules Verne, and the stuff that was happening with science fiction. (03:23) Before that, that's where things get really, really interesting because there shouldn't have been anything in the sky unless it was hatched and had wings, right? That's it. well, flying squirrels. All right. Okay. All right. You got a couple of other, got a couple of other things out there, but yeah. And so when you push it back and the further that you go, now we have covered, uh, a couple of these, uh, And I want to say that not as in-depth as we are going to do today. (03:56) We have covered some of these in the past, and those are going to be there. But I've got a couple of very interesting cases that I don't think anybody has ever heard of, and so do you. We've got an interesting list. And we're going to go in chronological order, right? That would be ideal. AJ Raffles, funny enough, I am drinking British tea as we speak. (04:19) It's the best with milk and sugar. And W. Decker, thank you so much for that. I do appreciate it. If you're excited for the show, hit that like button right down below. So I'm going to start off with the first one, sharing my screen here. Because we're going to go to the First Punic War. I think that's a great place to start. (04:35) So we're going to pull this image up. of one of the historians. So back in 218 BC, during the First Punic War, Roman historian Levy documented unusual celestial phenomena, including a phantom ship and round shields, which I saw in the live chat. people mentioning, and it was gliding through the sky. And so these sightings were among several prodigies of uncommon events considered omens from the gods during this time frame that were reported in Rome during significant military conflicts. (05:16) And such phenomena were interpreted as divine signals reflecting the gods' favor or displeasure and often led to public rituals to appease these deities. This is important for two reasons. One, We have a UFO sighting predating 1903. That's going to be our new timeline for today, but more so on that. And I actually mentioned this on Tuesday's show and shows for a lot of shows to be fair. (05:43) And that is why do UFOs have an interest in war watching conflict between humans? For what reason? And here looking at the first Punic war based off of what Levy was able to collect and It's being shown here as well. And so his depiction of these round shields were moving through the sky in a ship-like manner and had... (06:08) his readers fully intrigued, fully engulfed in what these military officials were seeing. And so these ancient accounts are deeply rooted and were deeply rooted in the religious and cultural fabric of Rome, where divine intervention was a commonly accepted explanation for unexplained phenomena. And the thing is, With the more cases that we're going to cover as we get a little bit closer to modern time, that description will change just a little bit. (06:42) But I think this is a really important place to start because our environment, our cultural background, our schools, shape the way that we view our world around us, our environment. And if we don't understand something, we're going to place it in a box where we can begin to. And so for them during this timeframe, it was, it's the gods, it's an omen, and we must do as we seem, as we deem fit. (07:11) This was a case that I had not heard of. I didn't know that UFOs were seen during the first Punic War in 218 BC. Jimmy, what do you think about this case starting off for today's show? The interest here, I think, for all of us, and you've got to go back to the religious context of all of this and the way that citizens were taught and told things and how news was shared. (07:51) Everything had a type of religious spin to it. And I was talking about this last night with Dr. Heather Lynn, and I talk about this subject a lot. It's very important to put everything into context. And it's very easy to say, well, angels could have been aliens. You know, what were the lights in the sky guiding Moses through the desert? What was seen above different battles and these weapons that were spoken about? We're talking about light rays and things that were toasting Roman fleets. (08:33) What was actually going on with all of that? Because they didn't have the reference that we have today, which is... Movies, books, science fiction, magazines, in addition to the stuff that we see in the sky, but we can think about aliens and the universe and planets and extraterrestrial life. We have a different way of framing it. (08:58) But back then, they did not. So when you see something strange in the sky, how are you going to make an account of it? How are you going to tell people about it? How is the news about this shared? Well, you're going to put another spin on it. It's the gods helping us win this battle. You can't say, well, it's flying saucers from Mars. (09:26) You can't do that. And that's the way that not only with this and many, many, many accounts that were B.C., How were they framed so that the populations, you know, the towns didn't freak out? You always had to put another spin on it. It's the spirits protecting us from losing this battle. It's instructions from heaven. (09:55) It's contact with angels. And that's why I find it very, very interesting because they were trained. seeing something in the skies. They were encountering beings that they couldn't put into words. They didn't have another way to do it. So yeah, that's why this account, not only from 200 BC, but so many others are very, very important. (10:21) I'm looking at the clock. We have so much to cover. I have another case that's immediately after this one. Well, it's 500 years later, but But that established a trend in Europe, and we're going to be covering big chunks of Europe this afternoon. And specifically, we're going to start off with Ireland. (10:46) And I have an account from 740 A.D. in Ireland. 740. Yeah, 740 A.D. And it's called, the case is called... The airship of Klamanoik. Now, Klamanoik. And for those of you that want to look it up, it's C-L-O-N-M-A-C-N-O-I-S-E. Now, it went through the media back then. It's part of history. It's part of a historical anecdote related to numerous medieval sources. (11:31) Though the original report in the Irish media simply mentioned an apparition of ships with their crews in the sky over Ireland in the 1740s. Later accounts through the Middle Ages progressively expanded on this with picturesque details. First, the ships were reduced to one ship over Telltown, f (12:00) rom which a crewman... Now, and what I'm about to say has been repeated repeatedly. in different locations around the world. It's very strange. All the way around Europe, the Middle East, and in the United States. Now, I want you to listen to what I have to say. Now, is it folklore? Is it mythology being repeated, right? Oral history and oral mythology and tales and stories? Could be. (12:27) Or is it that these were actual events and this was happening over and over again at different sites around the world? So here's what happened. First, the ships were reduced to one ship and a crewman threw and then recovered a fishing spear. from the ship, okay? The scene shifted to the Abbey of Clonmacnoy, and then later in Britain, the fishing spear was changed to an anchor, which snagged on some feature of the church. (13:05) The sailor, that's how he was described, the sailor who climbed down to release it was also said to be in danger of drowning, check this, in the thicker air of the lower world right now to have that that we're talking about 17 or 740 7 4 right after the dark ages and the thicker air on the ground the sailor was in danger of drowning where do these concepts come from This is a very, very strange case, which is going to take us t (13:49) o the... When you hear that, what goes through your mind? Honestly, honestly, I have no idea. This is a really just... It's one of those cases that stands out like a sore thumb. First, for the time period. Second, you're dealing with monks from this church called the Klonmach Noyes Church or Temple. And then they're able to recount this story. (14:10) And what's even more bizarre as it continues, at least allegedly, because it was later reported in different newspapers across Ireland during that time frame. And they had mentioned that when the monk was attempting to help this fisherman, this salesman to the best of his ability to cut the rope or something. (14:31) this entity, we shouldn't call it an entity because we don't know what it is, cut the rope himself, left, and then went back to the ship, and then the ship just disappeared. Yeah. This is in the 740s. It's crazy. I don't want you to get away from what you just said. The accounts of which were numerous, there were lots of witnesses to this, all said the same thing. (15:00) The ships just returned to the sun. It's like, wait, wait, what? What are they seeing? Yeah, yeah, go ahead, continue. Here's something that I would like to mention, because it seems that historians, archaeologists and day to day people don't always give people from the past a bit more credibility. (15:27) And let me provide you an example. In today's world, in the 21st century, specifically, let's go from the year 2018 onward. We are so fixated on our phones that we're never looking around us. We're not as perceptive as we used to be. People during this time frame had to be in order to survive. (15:47) They had to know the weather. They had to know the basic constellations. Because if they didn't, there were consequences. Now everything is taken care of. We can just go to Walmart and there's no big deal. But the reason why I want to bring this up is because First of all, we would love to take what they have to say as credible, number one. (16:10) But number two, their mentality was a bit different. And I think here, because I've never spoken to anyone from that timeframe, but let's say I did, I would like to think that they are more perceptive than what we are today. So when they are saying this in a bit different, in this bizarre detail, I want to take that detail and obviously write it down and then revise it with them. (16:32) Let me provide you just one more example on this with people from the ancient times. You are able to tell them something. It could be a sentence. It could be a paragraph. And they could very nicely recite it back to you. This is practiced for the shamans and storytellers, Native American tribes. It was practiced for eunuchs during the different Chinese dynasties. (16:57) And today, you can't memorize one or two sentences. And if you can, you are amazing. But your average person cannot be able to do it precisely and recite it back to you during that time frame. And we can look, let's say, from the 1700s going backwards They were better at it than what we are today. So here I would like to, it doesn't really mean anything, but I'd like to get in the benefit of the doubt on this really bizarre case that just stands out compared to any other one. (17:29) It's such a great point. You know who knew how to write? Monks. the clergy. Those were the educated. Nobody knew how to write. You had scribes, but the scribes would write down the oral traditions that were handed down generation after generation. And they were told and remembered word for word. Now, yeah, it's like the game telephone. (18:00) What's going to happen at the end of the line? Is it going to be the same as what started? I understand that. But you have to think about the importance of remembering. Now, today, Christina, we have difficulty with all of the knowledge that we have. right, all of the Marvel movies that we can watch, Independence Day, all of that, with all of that knowledge, we still have difficulty in describing strange phenomena. (18:31) So now push that back 1,000 years. Push that back 2,000 years and try to describe that when you don't have Will Smith and the Men in Black to compare things to. You don't have that. We can repeat it. Well, it kind of looked like we could do that. It looked like the Imperial cruiser in Star Wars. We can do that. (18:59) But not back then. So we need to really honestly respect what they were trying to say and try to describe. Which takes us straight to, if we want to continue this strangeness, 1211 in Ireland. What happened there? Well, we're looking at the same case here. And the thing is that depending on where you look, you're going to get significantly different dates. (19:29) But this one, when it comes to the airship of Klon-McNoise, it did take place in the 740s. Now, however, here's what's really interesting. According to the JSTOR.org, which is a journal article, Website that provides pretty ancient articles when I'm saying ancient, I'm saying like a few decades to a few hundred years. (19:49) But it says here that based off of the investigations done on that particular case, the article dates range from nine from seven for the three seven forty four seven forty eight and seven forty nine. and this I want to bring this into account because first we're dealing with snail mail at the slowest level okay where you have to just kind of go to different districts and and and like provinces and towns on on a horse on a donkey or who knows what so probably getting it from point a to point b could take a few months could (20:24) take a year to get it documented and shared in that town like Cork in Dublin, for instance, right? So this could be a reason as to why these dates have varied and why that might be the case in some other stories and accounts that we might cover a little bit later on those variations. People say, oh, if there's a variation on a date, that means it can't be true. (20:46) That means it's a hoax and not necessarily. Number one, people's memory is not always the best. But number two, when you are dealing with that very slow transfer transportation of, information and mail and newspapers yeah it's going to take you a little bit of time and then on top of that you got to find someone who can read read and write I want to say reach which is like read and write in one word that should be a word but it's not but then you got to find that and that also takes time and money as (21:18) well so ireland has a pretty interesting history when it comes to ufos it's mainly known for its hauntings and all of its very ancient castles but but UFOs still want to be seen there too. Well, now, yes, except here, the two incidents are 550 years apart. That's a great length of time. It is. And there is some variance in the story too as well, but they also account for eyewitnesses of the time period. (21:59) So the case that I'm talking about, 1211 A.D., it's called the Gervase of Tilbury, that's the paper, recorded a strange event in the borough of Cloria in Ireland. During a Sunday mass at the church of St. Conru in the borough of Cloria, Clora, An anchor was seen to descend from the sky and hook on the church door. (22:27) The parishioners watched as a man seemed to swim down to the anchor from the skyship to try and release it. The local bishop stopped the people from capturing him, and he swam, and that's in quotes from the paper, by the way, he swam back up the to the ship, cut the rope, and the ship sailed away. The anchor is said to have been kept within the church. (22:54) Okay, the exact same story has been attributed to a number of other places, including Kent in the United Kingdom, Bristol, and Somerset of the same year. Now, back to your point. How long does it take for news to travel? Today, it's instant. Back then, to have these same incidents reported across the United Kingdom in the same year, is somebody riding around on horseback, right, and repeating this story? Is it being reported? delivered from a newspaper in Ireland, makes it over to the UK, and people are reading this tale, (23:42) and suddenly it spreads across the UK? Or is it what I had said earlier? Were these incidents happening at the same time? That it's not necessarily a story that you heard from the next island over or the next city over on the other side of the country and somehow it's come down to you and now all of a sudden it becomes an event locally for you. (24:07) Is it that or was it that there was a ship or ships? In the sky, that was lowering ropes and beings were coming down. Now, they were described as ropes, right? They don't know what an electric cable is. How about a hose to get water out of the ground, a pumping system, anything like that. Fiber optic cable going to, you know, they, they describe it as ropes and, and to have an anchor on the other side of it, uh, It could have been anything. (24:46) It could have been anything. But this is how they described it. So I'm not too fast to jump onto it's a tale that was repeated and spread across. No, it doesn't work that way. I'm going to give you one example. It's going to be really quick. You have a band. You're a poet. You're going to be doing live poetry at a club, and you're handing out flyers. (25:19) And you hand out 50, 100 flyers, 200 flyers. And you're thinking to yourself, yeah, I'm probably going to have 20, 30 people show up. Not 500 flyers. Man, we might, yeah, I get 100 people there. And nobody shows up. How long does it take for flyers for that? It's the same thing with newspapers back then and periodicals and things that were printed. (25:49) They didn't print up 10,000 or 100,000 things and pass them out and hope for the news to spread. It took a long time. It took a long time. And it just doesn't happen that way. And so if you can look at it in that frame of mind, you can hand out all the flyers you want. How long does it take the news to spread from person to person? It takes a long time. (26:15) So in these cases that are recorded in the historical record, is it from one event that happened in Ireland and it just spread across? Or is it that there were multiple ships doing the same thing at the same time? And I kind of give credit to everybody seeing what they saw. I'm with you on that one. And I just want to just mention something, kind of give people an idea and a timeline when it comes to newspapers. (26:50) The first newspaper was created in 59 BCE, just to kind of put a date out there for people to grasp a little bit better. We're just going to just move a few years later, and we're going to also move on over to Japan. In 1235, according to the Azuma Karami, which is a medieval Japanese text, it mentions that General Yuritsune and his troops were encamped for the night when they witnessed these very strange lights in the sky. (27:33) And so the display went on for hours. a good while they say about an hour or so with the lights encircling each other and moving through the sky in these very weird loops so obviously confused and shaken the general ordered his most intelligent men to look into the matter and report back to him. And interestingly enough, their findings were very simple to any kind of modern-day investigations. (28:04) They were observing it, they were writing it down, and then using their knowledge to provide an explanation. But their explanation wouldn't fly today. No, they debunked it. They debunked it. They were debunking in 1235, yeah. They did, and they gave a really interesting explanation. They said... Look, General, there's nothing to worry about. (28:25) It's very natural. It's simply, and here's the simple explanation, the simple answer that you are demanding from us, and it's the wind that's making the stars sway. Yeah, the wind is blowing the stars around in the sky. Sounds like Project Blue Book. Sounds like swamp gas, leather balloons. Yeah, yeah, swamp gas. (28:47) Here we go, right? They were doing that in 1235. And the general, like you said, he's camping with his army, and they see these lights in the sky swirling to the southwest. It's an army. This is 1235. They're writing this down. They're documenting this. And they went on all night into the early morning, and he kept his troops and lookouts, right? You have spies. (29:18) You have guys out there doing their thing, watching these and observing. Is it the enemy with the secret weapon? All of these things come to mind, and that's what happened here. And when nothing ultimately happened and they weren't attacked, yes, he goes to his smart guys, his consultants, his military consultants, and says, okay, go and speak to everybody. (29:46) Come back to me with a report. And for them to say, general, it's completely normal, dude. Dude, imagine being your general dude. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dude, it's natural. It's natural. It's only the wind making the stars sway. And that's a quote from the report, by the way. And yeah, it does remind you of the way things are debunked today. (30:18) And what we don't have in this account is the general's response, right? Are you kidding me? Is that the best you can do? Are you trying to, you know, are they trying to influence the general and what he saw like swamp gas, right? It's a weather balloon trying to alter what people know, what they saw. (30:43) And so they have to go back and second guess themselves. And in this case, the general is expected to believe that the wind is blowing the stars around. And isn't that in of itself, Christina, isn't that an interesting explanation? It is, and it displays that people have always attempted to explain away things to the best of their ability with the foundation that they have on knowledge, which demonstrates that, number one, to know all is to know nothing, to admit that you know nothing, because while we might (31:24) think we have the foundation today, understanding the physics that we know, beginning to understand quantum entanglement, In 10, 20 years, we might say, oh, my God, people in 2024 were stupid. They knew nothing about physics or quantum entanglement just because our understanding, our research, and maybe even our equipment will change and has changed since then. (31:50) And so when people display themselves as, oh, I know everything, it's like, okay, buddy, go sit down and have some ice cream or something. That's exactly it. I keep going, but you make such great points. That is exactly it. Now, today, the same type of, right, swamp gas, if we go out and we see something, and today we're hearing... (32:16) different descriptions, a way of describing phenomena in the sky that it's the best that we can do with our knowledge of where we are today in science and technology. And one of the words that keeps being used a lot, and I do it too, is interdimensional. Because we're talking about portals, the knowledge of wormholes, faster-than-light travel, and the possibility of other dimensions and things coming in and out of our dimension. (32:50) So what do we say? Interdimensional. That explains a lot what we would see in the sky. If something just appears and then disappears. Is it interdimensional, coming from one place and going to another? We see it for a moment here in the here and now. But that also applies to the phenomena going back hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years. (33:14) The descriptions are the same. They're having difficulty describing. How do you, in today's world, when you see something like that, and I have, how do you explain that to somebody that doesn't know or have a reference point? Well, man, it was a light. It just appeared in the sky and went across, and then it just disappeared. (33:39) You know, I don't know. It was like it was interdimensional or something. And trying to describe that as crazy as it sounds, it's the same way that people tried to describe things hundreds, if not millennia years ago. I'm with you on that one. Right now, we have 391 people watching this live. If you're enjoying the show so far, or if we've covered a case that you have not heard of yet, hit that like button right down below. (34:09) Let's get to 300 likes. The next one I'm pretty excited to cover, and it has to do with Christopher Columbus. So back in 1492, when Columbus sailed the ocean blue- he also had a UFO sighting. And this is something that's usually passed when people talk about Christopher Columbus, that he discovered and found the Americus, when we now know that's not entirely true or the case. (34:36) But what I like about this particular story, and Jimmy, it's only going to enhance your point about attempting to describe something when you don't have the vocabulary to do so, because in his story, which was later published and it's called The Life and Voyages of Christopher Columbus, he documented that on October 11th, 1492 at 10 p.m. (35:00) , he saw this really strange light bobbing in and out of the water. And it says here, Christopher Columbus, while on deck of the Santa Maria, observed a light glimmering at a great distance. It vanished and reappeared several times during the night, moving up and down. And then suddenly it had these passing gleams and it was sighted four hours before land was sighted. (35:28) And what's even stranger is that he had continued with his journal entry, mentioning that it was like a candlelight was going in and out of the water. That was the best way he could describe it based off of his what he would classify as modern technology, his their modern inventions. And so I think that any point in time in history, we really need to evaluate their language, their previous inventions and their technology just to get an understanding from their point of view what they were really attempting to describe. (36:10) Okay. Now, don't shoot the messenger, okay? Don't do that. Don't do that to me, everybody. Because I am fascinated with this case. Except we've got a couple of issues that we have to work through. Let's hear it. Okay? There's two sightings that are attributed. Okay? There's two, not one. (36:37) There's two. The original captain's log... from Columbus has been lost to history. We cannot go back and see his handwriting or the writing of his scribe as it happened at that moment. We don't have that. What we do have is the oral rewriting of the captain's log that happened. And the author of that wasn't a part of Columbus's crew. (37:12) His uncle and his dad were, okay? And his uncle died before the book was published. They call it the DRO. Okay, so, but... His uncle and his dad recounted everything, and it was written down. That is what we have for Columbus, okay? So I want to be very clear with everybody. Now, the direct quotes from this are as follows. (37:50) The diario contains two entries regarding unusual lights observed by Columbus and his crew. The first occurred on Sunday, September 15th, 1492. And here is the quote. Quote, they sailed that day and night, 27 leagues and a few more on their route west. And on this night, at the beginning of it, they saw a marvelous branch of fire fall from the sky into the sea, distant from them four or five leagues. (38:27) End quote. That's the first sighting. That was strange. Now, Upon reading it today for myself, I'm thinking Meteor. Right? Not a shooting star because they say it was a ball of fire and it fell into the sea. Okay, so there's that. This first entry has been twisted around. Now, I've lifted the exact quote. (38:57) It has been twisted around over the years. Now, let's get to the second sighting, which I find much more interesting. The first one could have been a meteor, but the sighting happened. The second strange light event documented in the DREO occurred on Thursday, October 11th, by the way, the day after my birthday. (39:19) And this is what you had just mentioned here. Now, it was four hours before Columbus's ships encountered the first lands of America, islands of the Bahamas, but that's another story. But here is the entry, and this is the direct quote. the pinta remember there's three ships the pinta was a better sailor it was a faster ship and went ahead of columbus it found land and made the signals that the admiral columbus had ordered that's the direct journal entry That has been twisted around into some other things. (40:06) But what I find, like you had mentioned, I've read the same things. It was like candlelight. There was no journal entries. Columbus never wrote that down. No, no. We only have the diario and its writing, okay? But what is interesting here is that when Columbus, and it was later stated, he gets it. They didn't. (40:32) Signal anything. And we're talking about night in the Americas, and there's no electricity or anything else. What guided Columbus to the island? And it wasn't where the Pinta was. And so that's the part that, for me, gets really fascinating. What was illuminated in the sky? How were they, how was the Pinta illuminated? Going to fire flares up, right? You know, we think of that in the modern world, but back in 1492, and you're that far away, what is it that you were seeing? So I find that very, very, very, (41:21) very intriguing, right? Because it appears that Columbus got there and he's like, where is everybody? We found land. We followed the lights. Where's the Pinta? Right. And when he did apparently talk to the captain of the Pinta, he's like, man, where's Did you signal me? No. What are you talking about? That's why this part of the journal entry gets really, really interesting. (41:52) He was following lights, but they weren't from the Pinta. Okay. Now, there you go. These are the direct quotes. And yes, I find it very, very, very intriguing. And you also have his sighting of mermaids. I've always found that interesting, too, as well, and the way that that was written. But we don't have his original journals, and that's the part that all of this is coming from a second- and third-hand source. (42:21) The uncle, the dad, and the son. The son wrote everything down. So we're years away from the actual expedition. Good points, Jimmy. This is why we have these conversations because you bring in the goods that you can't just casually find. Gotta say, hey, you've been in this for a very long time. You know where to look. (42:43) When it comes to ancient sightings, stories, reported accounts, we have to. We have to cover this case. And it is the Nuremberg, Germany incident in 1561. I'm going to go ahead and tell this case because it took place April 14th, 1561. And residents... witnessed what seemed to be an aerial battle over the city. (43:11) And they described objects shaped like orbs, crosses, cylinders, and a black arrow-like vessel. And here we are seeing the rendition on screen that was published in newspapers when attempting to tell the rest of Germany, what these people in Nuremberg were seeing. And so they believed that the sky battle was a religious sign. (43:39) And the event was recorded on a woodcut broadsheet by Hans Glasser, who said, whatever such sign mean, God alone knows. And then you have other versions reported there. of knights battling in the sky and of three sons appearing after a battle but the biggest takeaway from this particular story is that number one it was investigated during that time frame you had witnesses but the biggest thing was being able to see a rendition as we are seeing on screen right here that was published soon after the incident that we (44:17) don't get to see as frequently as we would like when it comes to sightings that predate, let's say, the late 1800s. 100%. A hundred percent. This is one of, if we're going to go and discuss a documented case, this is the one I think we should all take a look at. Because the broadsheet, okay, you mentioned the first newspaper, right, in 500 BC or whenever that was. (44:55) Well, that wasn't printed. That was carved into rock. You know, written on papyrus. Gutenberg and the printing press came much later. Broad sheets, which are printed one at a time and stamped, were the communication method of the day. The broad sheet from Nuremberg was printed after the incident. The incident was on April 14th. (45:22) But what is great about this is that we have the date, and it is printed, and it's marked, and we have that to go on. It's illustrated by an engraving by Hans Glaser, and it is archived. The actual original document is archived in Zurich, Switzerland. Now, again, I'm going to quote directly from the broadsheet itself. (45:48) It says... Around dawn on 14th April, 1561, many men and women of Nuremberg saw what they described as an aerial battle from out of the sun. Okay. All right. Now, what do you do with that? The broadsheet continues with, followed by the appearance of a large black triangular object and spheres falling to the earth in clouds of smoke, end quote. (46:28) Now, let's just stop right there. You can look at the broadsheet. You can see the black triangle that looks like a spearhead or something. The witnesses described it as a triangular craft. Spheres falling from the sky. Spheres! burning and crashing to the ground. Now, this isn't natural. This isn't flaming birds. (47:02) This is a battle that was seen in the sky, documented so much that not only was it in the media in Nuremberg with this broadsheet, but the story did get covered throughout the region. It was definitely a media event. The event itself was real. Now, when I look at the famous woodcut that we are looking at here on the screen, just picture there's a few things happening here. (47:35) You've got the town burning, right, because flaming objects are coming from the sky and crashing into the ground. You can see the spheres in the lower right-hand corner, everybody. There's the spheres falling from the sky and crashing into the city. And then look up into the sky, and what do we see here? You see the columns with the spheres on it? That's strange. (47:59) You've got the sun itself with objects in front of it. You've got these crosses in the sky all over the place, right? Just imagine what people were seeing. This is a dogfight and a battle over the city of Nuremberg. And they didn't have a way to describe this. For the woodcut, You know, the artist, again, his name is Hans Glazer. (48:31) Hans Glazer. Hans Glazer has got to accurately represent. It's like a court reporter, right? You've got to draw it out. And so he's doing the woodcut showing, is this what you saw? That's what we saw. Is this what you saw? This is what I saw. I find it absolutely fascinating. So, yeah, I would say that this is like New York Times, live news broadcast, accurate, Time magazine, whatever you want to say. (49:04) This is that version of that. They want it to be accurate. They want it to be represented. It's time stamped with witnesses. So, yeah, I think the Nuremberg case is about as strong as we get for historical documentation, Christina. Darth brings up a comment that I've never considered, and that is, it's the German version of the Battle of Los Angeles. (49:26) Yeah, we've got more. Okay, okay. Thank you, Darth. We've got more like this, too, as well. This isn't the only case that is like this. Yeah, let's go ahead. Let's go to Basil. And now, so we're going to go from 1561 to 1566. So this is five years later. And this is about as nuts as it gets to as well. (49:51) What happened over Basel? So in Basel, Switzerland, on August 7th, 1566, residents observed large black spheres moving rapidly in the sky at sunrise. And these spheres seem to engage in this combative display, changing colors and then just eventually disappearing. And this event lasted several hours, which left the people of Basel in a stage of total awe and confusion as to what the heck happened. (50:23) is going on here. And so here we are seeing yet another dogfight. So you have the Nuremberg in 1561. You have the one in Basel in 1566. And let me just let me just say this. Jimmy, when we're looking at these cases, number one, Switzerland and Germany, they're relatively close to one another. I'm not saying they're like amazingly close, but close enough, right? Only a few years apart, but we're seeing a lot of similarities. (50:51) The first one is that it is a long battle. It took place over several hours. It's in the sky. It's in a public place. And you're seeing a bunch of objects in the sky. In modern times, people pray to just see a UFO for a few seconds. Imagine. Imagine. You were given the opportunity to see it for a few hours. (51:12) And in 1566, what could be a mundane explanation for something like that, Jimmy? If you were in their shoes. There is nothing mundane about it. And it wasn't one sighting. It was mass sightings by the city. Okay? Now, the Basel Pamphlet, which was the newspaper of the time, of 1566... describes unusual sunrises and sunsets. (51:41) Celestial phenomena were said to have been fought together in the form of numerous red and black balls in the sky before the rising sun. Now, we have the journalist. We have the reporter. His name, Samuel Cassius. He says on the 27th and 28th of July and the 7th of August, so we have three nights, three mass sightings, local witnesses in Basel reported seeing three celestial phenomena. (52:11) The first is described as an unusual sunrise. The second as a total eclipse of the moon with a red sun rising. And the third like a cloud of black spheres in front of the sun. Then he goes on to say, and I'm quoting here, this is a direct quote. At the dawn of August 7th, we saw large black spheres coming and going with great speed and precision before the sun and chattered as if they were led in a fight. (52:47) Many of them were fiery red and soon crumbled and then extinguished. Now, I have to ask you, right, what were they seeing on multiple nights? In a description like that, they chattered as if they were led in a fight? That's not meteors, right? That's not something cosmic. There's something else going on. (53:16) And it wasn't one night. It wasn't two nights, but it was three nights over about a 10-day period, Christina. This one makes me feel lost for words when you're having a UFO flap take place. And again, just seeing it a few years after the one in Germany. And I was just kind of looking at the map to see how close Numenberg is to Basel. (53:47) And while I'm looking... Honestly, it's not that far. I don't know how many miles per se, but if I had to just pull out a number, if I had to guess, I would say about 100 miles, give or take a little bit. So really not that far. Let's say, for instance, OK, Jimmy, let's say we're looking at the exact same distance. (54:09) battle that took place in two different locations. What I mean by that is there was some kind of feud between who knows what in the sky in Nuremberg. And they were like, you know what, let's bring this over to new territory and let's bring it over to Basel, Switzerland. Is that a possibility? And let me explain. (54:29) Let me expand on this. Because if we look at any any war in any war in history, it doesn't take place on the same battlefield every single time. It changes. Enemy retreats and attacks again. Right. Could this be an example of that? Oh, it definitely could be. They were seeing something very, very similar. There was another case that you and I talked about about a year ago. (55:01) Very same descriptions, but it occurred in China. And you remember on the bridge with the artist, right, and the town? Very same descriptions here. Also, the red sun, that was a part of what happened in China, and it's also here in Switzerland and also in Nuremberg. The idea of suggesting an eclipse, right? A red moon and a lunar eclipse happening at the same time and then a week later. (55:37) So they were obviously seeing something go down in the sky. To have a lunar eclipse or something like this brought into play, they maybe thought that's what they were seeing, right? Now, you can go... and looked at celestial charts and software and back up to the date of April 14th, 1566, and was there a lunar eclipse over Basel, Switzerland on that date? And if there wasn't, then what was everybody else seeing? So there you go. (56:15) And could it have been a ship that went in front of the sun, went in front of the moon, something else blocking it out, which was reported in both cases. And if we swing this over to China, also very similar, but hundreds of years apart and thousands of miles in between. And if you're asking the question of how far apart they are, I just checked. (56:37) It's 206 miles or about 332 kilometers between Nuremberg and Basel. Now, you know, I know it was itching at least someone's brain because it was really bothering me to know the exact time. and the exact location and miles but the next one that we should go to while we're still focusing on europe is let's move on over to france and this specifically the time period and the year 1608 this is one that I hadn't heard of I don't know it's also it's another battle right it's another battle (57:15) in the sky it's another battle in the sky 1608. Some have called it the UFO battle of South France. Nice. That just rolls off the tongue. It's like such a great title. Now, it goes from Nice, Marseille, all the way to Genoa, Italy. All right? Now, this is when we talk about the Battle of Los Angeles. We're not going to go into a review here. (57:46) But what we did do here in Los Angeles is we shot anti-aircraft shells into the sky, 1,200 shells. We're trying to shoot down this craft that was over Los Angeles and moving down the coast. We never shot it down. Same thing happened here. Oh, yeah. Same thing happened. This was in 1608. It went from Marseille to Genoa, Italy. (58:16) They fired in Italy at the end of this. Are you ready? 800 rounds of cannonballs. That's crazy. Yeah. That's crazy. That's a lot of cannon fire. It's a lot of shot. The shot didn't make didn't shoot it down. Didn't scratch it. Didn't make a dent on the evening of August 5th, 1608. (58:43) Not one, not two, but three luminous lit up craft were seen over Nice, France. The craft were long. This is how it was described in the local media at that time. Are you ready? Now, you got to remember the description here on how they describe things in 1608. The craft were long, oval in shape, and flattened along their lengths. (59:14) Okay, now oval in shape, but flattened. Now, cigar-shaped? Are we talking about flying saucer shape? You know, but we are talking about oval and flattened along its length. With each having, and again, I'm quoting directly from the media, a strange mast on top of them. An antennae? Now, they're calling it a mask. (59:46) Why? They've got ships on the ocean. They know what sails look like. They know what a mast looks like. But here, talking about an oval-shaped craft with a single something sticking out of the top of it. I've seen enough UFO reports in my day to go, that sounds pretty familiar to me. That's the way they described it then, and we described it the same way today. (1:00:12) Now, let me continue. As if that wasn't whack enough, right? The bay water, this is a quote, the bay waters began to froth underneath them, the ships, giving off a dense orange vapor accompanied by a loud, unpleasant noise. Orange vapor, Christina? Yeah. From one of the craft, two, again, I'm quoting from the paper. (1:00:46) From one of the craft, two vaguely human-looking beings appeared. They were dressed in red clothes, covered with silvery scales, with huge heads and luminous eyes. Dun, dun, dun. Right, right, right? It's just like the two creatures holding cables or tubes attached to the craft jumped into the water and moved about their ship for around two hours. (1:01:25) When they returned inside of the object, all three left at a high rate of speed. Later that month, on the 22nd, it reappeared further south in Genoa, Italy, and that's when they rattled off 800 rounds of cannon fire. This one is just another one that really stands out from the crowd. It doesn't follow a lot of your conventional descriptions. (1:02:00) There are a few, sure, but especially when looking at this time frame, looking at 18-16-08, it's bizarre. Now, we have to think about something. What about the fashion sense? Yeah. Did that grab you? Right? Red flowing silver scales. Wow. Wow. Wow. Man. Glowing eyes, you know, coming off the craft. I love this case. (1:02:33) I love this case. I love this case. And the craft shows up. And what do we do? Shoot at it. Shoot at it. Shoot at 800 rounds of cannon fire. Do you know what? I put all of this into context. All right. Do you know how hard it is to manufacture cannonballs back then? The expense of it, right? 800 rounds of the gunpowder, the time that it takes to pack a cannonball and get everything in there and then turn around and light it and fire it and do that 800 times. (1:03:15) Right? That's expensive. That's all you got. You can fire everything. I'm being very serious. 800 cannonballs? Wow. And their comments, the comments from the newspaper prints from then said that they didn't scratch or dent the craft. It was impossible for that timeframe and their mentality of if a cannon hits you, that's it. (1:03:51) Walls are coming down. I think this is one of the great, great, great cases from Nice, from Marseille, all the way to Genoa, Italy. Now, again, I don't think it was Italy that fired at them. This is a French military defensive posture, and it was the French military that shot the cannonballs, not Italy. It's just one of those cases that I think needs to be addressed. (1:04:25) But we also have to ask ourselves this really important question. Did it really happen? All we have are these newspaper accounts, the eyewitnesses, and then you can take it or leave it on if you believe it or not. But it is something that does have that has to be addressed when covering these things on the next one. (1:04:40) some might be familiar with, and this took place in 1639 in Boston with Governor John Winthrop. Now, he in particular didn't see it, but he wrote it down when he was speaking to someone else. So on March 1st in 1639, John Winthrop opened his diary in which he recorded the trials and tribulations triumphs of his fellow Puritans as they made a new life in America. (1:05:12) And as the governor of Massachusetts Bay Colony put his pen to the paper, he began to recount a most honestly, just a very unusual event that had recently caused a stir among the English immigrants. So He wrote that year that a person that he was speaking to by the name of James Everill, he mentioned, according to Winthrop, said that he's a very sober and discreet man. (1:05:42) And two others had been rowing a boat in the muddy river, which flowed through swampland and emptied into a tidal basin in the Charles River when they saw a great light in the night sky. And it says, quote, When it stood still, it flamed up and was about three yards square. And then when it ran, it was... connected into the figure of a swine. (1:06:10) And so over the course of about two to three hours, the boatman said that the mysterious light ran as swift as an arrow darting back and forth between them and the village of Charlestown, a distance of approximately two miles. So diverse with credible persons saw the same light after about the same place, according to Winthrop. (1:06:32) So here we are witnessing a governor document his men seeing a really bizarre sight in the sky that was moving at intense speeds that couldn't be explained. And they described it as being three yards square. So if we're looking at our yards today, three feet equal one yard. So we're looking at three. (1:06:58) something that's nine feet, if we're looking and understanding their measurement is the same as ours today. But even then, let's say, Jimmy, you are minding your own business and you see something like this with other people with you, what would be going through your mind? Yeah, I covered this case. (1:07:21) I narrated a film called Extraordinary, The Revelations. I was the narrator on that film and And this case was featured in the film. So I was given the diary entries from John Winthrop. And reading the direct entries on this, I was totally fascinated with this case. I had heard about the case. I'd seen it briefly mentioned in a couple of documentaries, but to read his actual journal entry was absolutely mind-blowing. (1:07:59) Now, The way that you have just presented it here is generally exactly how it happened. These guys were in a rowboat. They're going with the current and heading. And they see this thing in the sky. It's moving around. It's straight. It gets low. It's in front of them. And all of this actually occurs. (1:08:22) And the way that they describe it, uh to be you know 10 feet uh square so they're not looking at something far off in the sky they're looking at something very low to them that they can come up with dimensions so I always found that very very intriguing and to say that it flamed up right it flamed up what it lit up That's another very interesting point that we have to take into account here. (1:08:53) But it also frigging shapeshifted. It shapeshifted. So it went from a square shape into a bird shape. Now, they say swine. Are we talking about pig? Are we talking about a bird? Is it taking the shape of an animal in the sky? Well, there's that part, but is it shapeshifting swine? into another type of equipment. (1:09:21) And this is the way that they didn't have a way to put it into words. Now, remember this. Now we also have missing time. And for Winthrop to write it down in this way, now, again, I'm going to pull a direct quote here. They say that in the course of two or three hours that this light ran back and forth in front of them as swift as an arrow. (1:09:56) Okay, now that's pretty fast. Okay, that's pretty fast. Parting back and forth between them and the village, covering this distance of about two miles. Then the governor writes that the strange apparition finally faded away. And when it did, the three men in the boat were stunned to find themselves one mile upstream as if the light had transported them there. (1:10:34) Yeah, and they had no memory of it. So are we, you know, today, oh, it's missing time. Oh, it's teleportation. They wrote this. This was their account. It was upstream. These are the things that you deal with on a daily life, right? Swimming upstream, we've all heard that. Somehow they got there. Somehow they arrived. (1:11:06) They don't know and they don't remember. They only found themselves in a place where they weren't supposed to be. And they said to themselves, the light must have brought us here. Love this case. I remember, Christine, I'm serious. So I have the script, I have the narration of this, and I have all this documentation. (1:11:30) I'm working with the director and, you know, in the middle of this film project. And I'm reading these journal entries and I'm like, man, we've got shape-shifting. We've got very fast travel. We've got teleportation. And we have missing time. And this craft lit up. All of this. It's one of the most fascinating cases. (1:11:58) And you've got to go back to our original point at the beginning of this show. This is 1639. 1639. Almost 300 years before the Wright brothers. Right? 250 years before hot air balloons. Right? So what is it that they were seeing over Charlestown? The Massachusetts Bay Colony. So important that the governor, John Winthrop, wrote it down in his diary. (1:12:29) Oh, and one last point before we move on. He made it a point to say, these are sober dudes, right? These are stable people. Yeah, it's very interesting how they—very credible citizen, right? That they want to stress that these are not crazy people. These are very normal, stable, sober, non-drinking, right? It's very, very interesting how he wants to make that point first in the journal entry. (1:13:09) Before I finish, you need to understand these guys were not drinking. Which is important to make it for your average reader. It does make it sound more credible when at the very least they just have a description of who they are and if you can trust them. Tim, I want to say thank you so much. And Mark, thank you for that as well. (1:13:31) I do appreciate it. Jimmy, can you do the honors of saying his last name? It's tradition. It is. It is. Mark, good to see you, my brother. The remaining of our time is very limited, and we have a handful of cases still to cover. So, Jimmy, which one would you like to cover next? I'll do this really fast. 1665 Strahlson. (1:13:51) Now, this is called the 1665 Strahlson UFO incident. On April 8, 1665, six fishermen witnessed an unexplained celestial phenomenon, an aerial battle, dun-dun-dun, in the skies above the Baltic Sea near Stralsund. As evening broke, a dark gray disc appeared high above the city center. At 2 p.m. in the afternoon on April 8th, 1665, they saw, again, I'm going to say shape-shifting and battle all happening at the same time. (1:14:32) This is in 1665. They saw great flocks of birds in the sky morph into warships. That engage in a thunderous air battle. The decks of the ships team with ghostly figures. Dun, dun, dun. When at dusk, a flat, round shape. This is a quote. A flat, round shape like a plate, end quote, appears above the St. Nicholas Church. (1:15:06) They run away. The following day, they find that they're shaking and trembling all over, and they complain, Christina, of pain. And so people assume that it might have to do, people now might assume or think it has to do with like the Havana syndrome or kind of radiation poisoning, just because there were a handful of these witnesses that felt this pain in the body that couldn't stop shaking, that got sick soon after. (1:15:41) And we've seen this before in other UFO sightings where people get very similar symptoms. Now, this one, I want to really emphasize the date took place in 1665. What's going on here? And this when you have those kinds of symptoms that is classified as data, that is classified as something that would be tangible enough to say they really did see something bizarre because it affected them. (1:16:10) All of them with no conventional explanation for that. And they're going to say, now we have, again, a church attributed to this, right? And that you did something bad. God made you sick, right? They have to explain it in these terms. And they did. It was kind of a debunking of this case that it wasn't something supernatural, paranormal. (1:16:38) This was God. And this happened above a church for a reason. And now, also, for me, and we need to move on, I've got one case, Christina, that nobody has heard about. And it's also the same year as Aurora, Texas. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I want to get this in because we're going to talk about Aurora, Texas. (1:17:02) But how many times do we have throughout history a sighting, something supernatural, something paranormal, and it involves, is seen around above a church? We've heard you today. Yeah, yeah, we have. And so does that add credibility to this, that, oh, the parishioner saw it, so therefore, right, the priest saw it, so therefore we have to trust the source here, the Puritans of the Massachusetts Bay Colony, right, where when you have something like this and it is an attribute, when it is added to it, is it because it's credibility? (1:17:50) right, adds to it, or it's believability, or is it religious in nature? Yeah, I've always found that fascinating. Okay, I'm looking at the clock. I don't want to run out of time. We're going to cover two cases here. And the second one will be, I'll hand it off to Christina, is the 1897 Aurora, Texas UFO incident. (1:18:15) But let's back up. 1897, Merkle, Texas. What? What? What? In the Houston Post for April 28th, 1897, check this. Are you ready? Told of churchgoers. Are you with me? In Merkle, Texas, returning home by night, who came across, are you ready? Now, this is 1897. A church, Texas, and a rope and an anchor. Like in Ireland. (1:19:08) Yes. Being dragged across the country until it finally snagged on a railway line. Not a church door. Not a church pew. Not a parishioner. Not a priest. A railway line. The rope, they saw, was attached to an airship with lights shining from its windows. Now, how crazy is that? Out of everything that we've covered today, Merkle, Texas in 1897 had it all. (1:19:47) Had it all. Had it all. Had it all. Had it all. Yeah. That was like a little cherry on top because I had never heard of that case before and taking place during that time frame in 1897. That's what you said, right? 1897. Yeah, 1897. And then on top of a church. We are seeing a theme today, Jimmy, looking at these ancient – To me, they're ancient. (1:20:12) Ancient cases. Now, you're going to do Aurora, Texas. Okay? I want to remind everybody what we're talking about here. Aurora, Texas was on April 19th. Okay? Merkle, Texas was on April 28th. Dun, dun, dun. Yep. Yep. And let's look at the clock. Go ahead. What happened in Aurora, Texas? Okay, so we're looking at the exact same year, looking at 1897. (1:20:48) And with this... The exact same week. The exact same week. That's crazy. Okay, so... Yeah, it is. It's crazy. I want to make this one quick just because a lot of people are familiar with it, but if you aren't, hang tight. We will give you that foundation. So what we're looking at here, and here we're seeing a newspaper clipping, we're seeing a rendition, and then we're also seeing a gravesite. (1:21:16) Why are we seeing a gravesite, Jimmy? Well, I'll answer that for you. It was a rhetorical question. Because aliens allegedly were... Buried in Aurora, Texas. So what happened is there was an alien craft in the sky and it crashed violently into Judge J.S. Proctor's windmill. Then with this devastating crash, there were these entities that had passed away and they thought to themselves, the best thing to do is to give them a proper burial. (1:21:52) And they did exactly that. It spread like wildfire. There were newspapers, there was information about the grave. And to this day, you're able to go and visit, but it's believed that gosh, I want to say like probably a few decades ago, if not a century ago by now, it was dug up. And if you attempt to re-dig that grave, you're not going to find anything, nothing at all, maybe an empty coffin if you're lucky. (1:22:19) But with this one, it is the most or one of the most famous cases when it comes to Texas in the United States. aside from the Lubbock Lights or Stephenville, but this one also has a lot to it. You have a craft, you have newspaper clippings, you have a judge that was a witness to this, and you have alleged alien bodies as well. (1:22:42) And it all took place in 1897. Yeah, and you have the quotes that the pilot of said craft did not survive and was buried with, and I quote, with Christian rites. So it was given a proper burial. Now, there's been a lot of investigations going into this, going to the graveyard there in Aurora, Texas. It's been ground penetrating radar. (1:23:19) The original gravestone was stolen. There's been another one that was placed, but it was just above ground. There wasn't an actual burial that was done there. And this has gone on over the years. Also, there were reports of the wreckage of the craft dumped into the the well that was next to the windmill of J.S. (1:23:49) Proctor, Judge Proctor. There's also reports that some of the wreckage was buried with the pilot or the alien. There's that, too, as well. But there's more. There are two other. Now, we can go back to the original article, which is here. Okay, so we have that. We have all of the original witnesses, but there are two other eyewitnesses to the crash. (1:24:20) That's right. You have Mary Evans. She was 15 at the time, and she told of how her parents went to the crash site. They wouldn't let her go. She had to stay home, but her parents did, and it was her parents that discovered the alien body. Now we have names. We have Charlie Stevens. He was 10 years old at the time, Christina. (1:24:47) And he says he saw the airship trailing smoke as it headed north towards Aurora. He wanted to see what happened, but his father made him finish his chores, his words. And later he told how his father went to town the next day and saw the wreckage from the crash. So I don't know what to do with Aurora. I just don't know. (1:25:17) When we have... This time period of 1897 and some of the science fiction that is now coming out around the world in 80 days and the time machine. We have some things that are starting to surface. But in rural Texas at that time, were they reading these books? Did they know about the ideas of science fiction and life on Mars and this kind of talk that was going around? Probably not. (1:25:49) Was something seen in the skies? Did something actually hit the windmill? There's been a lot of debunking that has come into this, saying that, oh, the well attributed to the windmill was built later. It wasn't there when the windmill was running, too. That well isn't attributed to the function of the said windmill, right? that was there. (1:26:16) The two weren't connected together. There's been a lot of debunking. The other part is that the well itself was filled in Why would you fill in a well? I don't know. But they have dug and dug and dug in that well and have not come up with any debris. Now, is it an attempt to debunk this? Is it true research going into this? Why can't we go back to the cemetery? We don't want to damage or do anything to the cemetery. (1:26:51) But I think that we should... go back and do some real research there. And it's never really been done. There's been attempts at it in very small areas, but no, no full research has gone into this. Also, there has been the JS Proctor, the judge, and I don't want to get this incorrect, but there have been reports that the judge never had a windmill. (1:27:22) So that this was written as humor, that this was just an article that was written that way. It was never meant to be real because they wanted tourism in Aurora. Now, that sounds like debunking to me. It does. And then when you go over to Houston, Texas, and Merkel and the reports there that were from a week later, sounds to me like something was happening in Texas at that time. (1:27:54) One article came out of Dallas. The other one came out of Houston. We could do an entire show on Texas by itself just because it's had so many UFO sightings and have a lot of strange encounters there. I'm really glad that we were able to finish off with Aurora because even though it's a famous one, It had to be addressed today. (1:28:17) I do want to say, Jimmy, thank you so much for joining me this week for mysteries of the history. It was honestly, it was a really, really fun show. We covered so much in a short period of time and you were able to bring in so much extra knowledge that I would have missed. So I just want to say thank you for that. (1:28:36) Christina, you're the best. I'll see everybody tonight on Fade to Black. All right. Behave and be well. Another great show, Christina. Bye. If you enjoyed the show, hit that like button right down below. Tomorrow is going to be Strange Weekly News. You don't want to miss it as it will be live covering all the strange news and mysterious headlines from around the world. 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