DRAGONS and Ancient Tales of the Flying Serpents

Show Transcript

Did dragons once roam the earth or are they all just mere fantasy and misunderstanding or even misidentification? Today, we will do a deep dive into the different countries, lores and legend into these fantastical creatures, along with looking at the archaeological finds as well. Hello and welcome to this episode of Mysteries with the History, where you'll be taken on a wild ride into the unknown, the strange, and the mysterious. Like you, I have questions, and like you, I want answers. And with each episode together, we will peel away the layers to look for the truth. Let me bring in my co-host, Jimmy Church of Fade to Black Radio. It didn't work, did it? It didn't work. You tried. You tried. You tried. You tried. I just posted. I'm just going to let everybody know. I'll get the votes in. I just posted. I recorded video of Christina and I conversing before the show today. Shall I post it? Oh, oh, it's Christine. It's like, are we talking about? I already forgot. I bet you have. I bet this is going to be a great dragons, right? Yes. Right, right, right, right. Now, this is the easiest opportunity for me to go, okay, what happened this week? Because this is straight out of nowhere. And I was so happy this morning when you take, you know, today's dragons. I'm fully engaged, but what gives? Did you ever used to watch the TV show with your kids, Dragon Tales? I did. Dude, that show was sick. Especially during the early 2000s. That's where it's at. So that slightly inspired it for today. Are you watching? Wait, wait, wait. Are you currently binging Dragon Tales? not binging it just happened to pop up and I'm like oh my gosh I used to love this show as a kid right next to spongebob it was a great show it was a great show but um okay anything else or was it just that I mean I that's that's good enough that that's the main reason but also I think a lot of us have a very special place in our heart when it comes to dragons and many people that look at it from the fantasy perspective like we really want them to be real but what if they really did roam the earth 10 000 years ago 5,000 years ago, maybe just a few hundred years ago. You know what I mean? And also, you have Game of Thrones or House of Dragons. I mean, people are in love with those TV shows, but of course, number one is Dragon Tales. All right? I know people are really vibing with that one. But aside from that, people love those other more popular adult TV shows, and I think it's now the time to talk about it. And W. Decker, thank you so much for that. Yeah, very cool. Did you ever see the movie... I don't want to go all Hollywood, but did you ever see Rain of Fire? No. Okay. Write that down. That movie is so good. I've seen it so many times. It's so good. And it's a medieval time period of a village. Yeah. No, it's not a comedy, young lady. It's a village in Europe defending itself from dragons. It's called Reign of Fire. It's really good, man. Let's see. In the comments, who has seen Reign of Fire? W. Becker has, and I thought it was spelled Reign as in R-A-I-N, but not the way that he spelled it. Yeah, you see this? You see this? Rain of Fire is so good. It's a really, really, really good movie. Always wanted to see Rain of Fire, but never have. Dragon slayer. Great movie. That's a, that's another good one. Okay. So, um, let's, let's jump into this and, and I'm going to, uh, kind of start with a, just a really quick thought that I've repeated and repeated over the years, Christina. And it's this, the depictions that different cultures and countries have had of dragons and goes back thousands of years and it's not to me it can't be a coincidence that these images and what a dragon did and what it was um to have what what what drove this what inspired this were dragons at some point alive and what were they seeing and I man I'm I kind of think dragons were real at one point. And I have seen, and I'm okay with saying that, I have seen a couple of scientific papers written up on how a dragon could actually breathe fire. And what would be involved with this? Natural bags of gas inside, you know, hydrogen, right? These different flammable gases that... were were produced in the body and then there and then ignited and breathed out. And I've seen this a few different a few different times over the years. I always found that really compelling and really interesting. So for me, there's just too much of it. I have got we'll get into this in a minute. But I have compiled, I went back to my notes over the years, my show notes. And one of the things that I had compiled was the list of coats of arms with dragons on it. And the list is a mile long. And before you think about it, it's just, it doesn't matter what continent you're what culture, what family, Companies, corporations, you know, restaurants. I'm talking about a couple of thousand years ago, all the way through to today. What is it that would inspire a country, a family, a hotel, a restaurant, an inn to feature a dragon as their logo or on their coat of arms or a country's flag, for instance? It's pretty interesting. And the list is it's, it's, it's thousands. It's thousands. I don't have that much time, uh, to do it all, but I have a pretty good list here. And that says to me, something is, has been going on historically. And it's a huge level of dedication to put it as a logo or even to have it as a flag like the Welsh flag. That means that, like you said, there has to be something to it. Now, of course, there are also countries flags that have unicorns on it and a phoenix and we have dragons and we can go on and on. A lot of those actually take place in Europe, fun little fact. But when we look at this conversation of dragons, you know what? I think a good place for today is looking at some more ancient historical sightings, starting off with Marco Polo, because he had a sighting that he classified in his book that he saw a huge serpent. And I'm going to share my screen here of an image of Marco Polo While I tell you this pretty interesting story, there he is, Mr. Marco Polo. But see, kids only know him as playing that game. Marco Polo. Best game ever. Best game ever. Best game ever. I don't know why adults don't play it. Like, I don't know why we don't even play it. Oh, adults? No, adults play it too. No, Marco Polo is awesome. I just don't have friends. So this famous... Traveler. Gosh, the word like didn't even couldn't even find its way through my brain. By the name of Marco Polo, while in the 13th century, he claimed to have encountered a huge serpent while traveling to China. Now, that's an interesting correlation right there. And he described the creatures with two legs, sharp teeth and jaws wide enough to swallow a man. And this is really interesting because this is a pretty. prevalent example of dragons. But also when we look at China, China has different types of dragons, some that are celestial earth dragons, some that have legs and some that do not. But here, based off of his description in the 13th century, he says it has two legs, sharp teeth, and a jaw so wide, it could swallow a man just recently, let's say in the last 50 years or so, We have found a python in Indonesia that is able to swallow people and alligators, and we have proof of it. Now, there have been stories of reptiles like this for centuries, but it seems that science... And explorers are just now catching up with this. So in his book, The Travels of Marco Polo, this is where he described his encounter with this huge serpent. And it says here, quote, Here are found snakes and huge serpents of such vast size as to strike fear into those who see them, and so hideous that the very account of them must excite the wonder of those who hear it. I will tell you how big and wide they are. You may be assured that some of them are 10 paces in length and some are more or less. And in bulk, they are equal to a great cast for the bigger ones, but about 10 palms in girth. Let's just say we all have the same size hand, like an average man. That's what? Five, eight. OK, those 10 palms of that's huge. That's huge. And then it continues. They have two, four legs near the head, but for foot, nothing but a claw like the claw of a hawk or that of a lion. The head is very big and the eyes are bigger than a great loaf of bread. The mouth is large enough to swallow a man whole and is garnished with great pointy teeth. And in short, they are so fierce looking and so hideously ugly that every man and beast must stand in fear and tremble before them. Can I just say that his description of comparing eyeballs to loaves of bread needs to be in every poetry book ever? Like, that's amazing. But aside from that... yep I'm with you on that one but aside from that it's very interesting to hear his description of these dragon type creatures especially in china when in the eastern cultures and traditions dragons are depicted as symbols of power symbols of prosperity protection it's even in their calendar zodiac like this year is the year of the dragon and as I saw in one of the comments today and when we're looking at all of these different things and then we compare it to the western view of dragons you know wales is a great example of this england really all of the uk one sees it as terrifying hideous slay it and save the maiden and the east sees it as leave it alone it's their magical creatures and they're usually here to protect the earth the celestial realms to let people know that immortals are coming and I think it's it's rather unique to see the contrast in these two parts of the world looking at what we would classify as the same creature Yeah, that's right, that's right. And the depiction by Marco Polo, which is very similar to, and I'm going to jump into a couple of others right now, very strange how this happens. Also, a quick mention, there's a new movie out, it's called Damsel. And if you haven't seen it, this is another dragon slayer type movie like dragon slayer, which I mentioned earlier, um, uh, go. and and and watch damsel and and then look at the mythology that is involved with that dragon and where it came from and and so forth um same thing with dragon slayer I mentioned reign of fire reign of fire uh again is is modern weapons against uh a dragon of which dragons I should say make that plural um really really cool but it's the same depicts in the same description that's not only in Europe, as you mentioned, and a lot in the UK, but we have Mesopotamia, we have Mayan, look at the Mayan sculptures with the dragons and The serpents with dragon heads that go down the sides and stair steps of temples and on walls. It's extraordinary. What is it that they were seeing? Now, there's another part to this before I move on to... I'm going to mention... I need the elder first. I'm going to go there. So you get ready. Um, but I do want to mention that in, in modern Iraq, uh, they just, this was about, uh, two months ago, a month ago, two months ago, just dug up one of the largest dragon sculptures I have ever seen. And this thing is, it's 20 feet long and, You know, 15 feet high, probably six or eight feet wide, ginormous. And which is the Usham Galu. We'll get to that in a second. But these cultures are all seeing the same exact thing now versus Marco Polo. check this out. This is Pliny the Elder. Now, he's a Roman author, and his depiction of dragons, I have, he's done this a few times, but I've got a major chunk of text here from him. Now, according to Pliny the Elder, a dragon could strangle an elephant with its tail. Now, so here's one of the direct quotes from Pliny the Elder. Now, if this doesn't remind you of what Marco Polo saw, I don't know what does, because the location... is the same that's that's the trippy part africa produces elephants beyond the deserts of the syrtes and in more uh mauritanium they are also uh found in the countries of ethiopia and and and the troglodyte now I don't know but as mentioned above But it is India that produces the largest, now this is a quote, as well as the dragon, which is perpetually at war with the elephant and is itself of so enormous a size that as easily to envelop the elephants with its folds and encircle them in its coils. The contest is equally fatal to both. The elephant is vanquished, falls to the earth, and by its weight crushes the dragon which is entwined around it. Now that's very, very close. to Marco Polo's description and the location. It is. And to give people some reference, he lived between 23 AD to 79 AD. And he wrote his work about dragons in his version of the encyclopedia called Natural History. And when we look at anyone's encyclopedia, when we read it, We take it as law. We take it as their word, right? That they've done the research and that's why they wrote it in those books. He didn't write it as a fiction story. He placed it in his encyclopedia during this time where I feel like these types of creatures or even cryptids were more openly spoken about, especially when it came to the Romans as well. And Android, thank you so much. It says many people in modern times have reported seeing dinosaurs from Bigelow's scientists at Skinwalker Ranch to your average dough, Joe. So maybe ancient dragon sightings are the same type of phenomenon. We're going to get into that later. Bingo. Bingo. Bingo. Nice job, Android. I think that we're all on the same page here, you know, just a little bit, where we'll talk about it a little bit later, but could there have been survivors of dinosaurs, right, that died off, that these ancient cultures... What if... Okay, we'll get into this. But what if they saw a T-Rex, right? Or a Triceratops, right? What are the ones that fly? A pterodactyl. Yeah, pterodactyl. What if they saw a pterodactyl? How many pterodactyl sightings have there been in modern times? A lot. A lot. I've had a lot of people on my show talk about their pterodactyl sightings. So could that be a part of it? We'll circle back. Let me do this. You mentioned the Welsh flag earlier. There are three. Do you have the flags ready? Three countries with dragons on their flags. Welsh, Wales, Malta. You have the Malta flag, the Maltese flag. Doesn't look okay. We don't. And the country of Bhutan. All three have dragons on their country's flags. Now, even crazier. are the coats of arms. Now, coats of arms of families, okay, okay, we're talking a million, right? There's a lot. There's a lot of coats of arms for different family names. How many of those feature dragons? The majority, all right? I'm just going to say that. But different coats of arms with dragons in an official capacity around the world, you have Adjara. You have the London boroughs of Brent Bromley. You have the Duchy of Sersk. You have the country of Georgia. You have Hong Kong. You have Iceland. You have Lancaster University. You have the City of London Corporation, by the way. You have Malia. You have Moscow. Moscow, the city of Moscow. You have the country of Russia. So both Moscow and the country of Russia have dragons on their coats of arms. Okay? You have Newport. You have the Chinese Nguyen dynasty. Right? That dynasty... Not only features a dragon on the coast of arms, but it goes back 2,000 years. You have the Norway Sats. You have the city of Poole. You have Sikkim. You have Valencian University in Spain. You had the Valencian community in Spain. Now, the Valencian community also dates back and was a group of countries and counties. You have Warsaw, West County in Poland. Now, I can go on and on and on and on. Just go look up Dragon Coats of Arms and look at the amount of images that pop up. It's crazy that you would go, what represents you? What represents you as a culture, as a family, as a geographic location? So what are we going to put on there? A dragon? Why? Well, right? I'm saying... They were living with dragons. It was something that was alive. As crazy as that sounds, Christina, I don't have anything else to go off of. And it's geographically, right, all over the world. There isn't a country around the world that doesn't have dragons in their culture. That's correct. And that probably has to be one of the most shocking parts when it comes to researching the topic of dragons is why are all of these cultures and countries simultaneously talking about this creature? If it never existed, why are we seeing this consistency? And if they did exist, where are they now? Were they all misidentified as dragons? Maybe not dragons, dinosaurs like pterodactyls? Or is there something more to it? Are they their own species? Kind of species. But the question that's burning inside all of us is where are they now? Are they still hanging out on planet Earth? I know, I know. Are they in caves that we just haven't been able to get to yet? Right, right, right. So let's swing in two directions here. Let's go with, I know what I, in my research, some of the earliest references to dragons are. And it goes to 3000 BC. And then when we go to modern history, we've got some, I mean, modern dragon wars going on in towns and villages. And so we'll get to that. But one of the earliest... When we talk about Mesopotamia, and I mentioned the Usham Galu earlier, which everybody has seen, the Usham Galu is the Mesopotamian lion dragon. Okay, now, now, stop right here. When you look at this, this is all over Mesopotamia. This is all over Iraq. It's on walls, it's in inscriptions, it's in history, and it's in statue form. all over the place. Now, this is a lion dragon demon identified with four legs, as you can see here, always with wings, always with a dragon's head and a lion type body. Now, It's carved in stone. It's carved on both walls and in statue. And the first depictions of it are 3000 B.C. 3000, third millennium B.C. Where is this coming from? And then it surfaces in the Mayan culture. It's in the Chinese culture. It's all over Europe going on at around the same time. But now let's go to Anunnaki Dragon. Yes. Who said that? Marty. Marty. Smart guy. Because Tiamat. is said to have clothed the raging lion dragon with fearsomeness. And that is in the epic of creation in the Enuma Elish. Right there. That's one of the oldest pieces of history that we have that is preserved for us. The god Nabu was described as, are you ready? He who tramples the lion dragon. They were using the word dragon 3000 BC. I just find this mind boggling. And could it be that they were seeing a species that wasn't extinct yet? Right? I'm just going there. Is it possible? To cement this for everybody, the woolly mammoth was still alive in Canada on islands a thousand years ago. So before you go and say, how is that possible? No, no, things survived. Right? Things survived. Wooly mammoths. So is it, is it possible? Everything is possible. But what was it that these cultures were seeing that was so important that they, they named it, they named it the dragon. And the cultures around the world were all doing the same thing. I keep repeating myself, but this is very, very important. It's not a question of somebody talking to somebody else and to somebody else. And then this myth spreads around the world 10,000 years ago. No, I believe that they were seeing something. Especially when we look at this image. And last week, we spoke about the Anunnaki. We have to ask, is this an Anunnaki right here on screen fighting this dragon lion? Because that's kind of what it looks like. And what's also very interesting here is the sizing of this creature and of this, and I'm putting this in quotation marks, person fighting it, right? So is it like... a misrepresentation of proportion? Is it to show power? Or were these actually the same height, which would be really interesting, mainly because from all of the I want to use the word historical folklore here and legends, is that these dragons are ginormous. Marco Polo even attempted to describe how big it was from what he saw back in the 13th century. And so to see it here on screen, that they are matching in height, I think it's worth mentioning. But of course, there is a lot of room for interpretation and display power as well. Right. But this is where I interrupt Christina, because it's very important. And I apologize for that Christina, but in most cases, your Kings, your gods are bigger than their foes. They are bigger than their people, than the citizens, than their wives and their children. They're always depicted bigger and intimidating and over. And here, where you have in this specific carving, That I'm trying to think of the god there, Nabu, that's Nabu slaying the dragon. Why is Nabu the same size? Right. So to keep it in proportion. Maybe that dragon is absolutely ginormous and bigger than Nagu. I'm just saying. I'm just going there because in every – it doesn't matter what culture you're looking at, whether it's Asian or Central or South American or in Europe – The gods and the kings are always big and intimidating. And that's not the way that Usham Galu has always been portrayed. Now, I mentioned earlier, before we move on, they just unearthed, archaeologists in Iraq, an Usham Galu statue. And this thing is huge. Do you have a picture of it? You have a picture of them pulling it out of the ground. It is one of the most beautiful sculptures I have ever seen. And I think they've dated this to mid third millennium BC, around 2500 BC. And which would have been around the time, allegedly, of the founding of Egypt, right? This is a long time ago. Do you have it? Oh, she's muted herself. I can unmute you. Because I can do it. Okay. You got it? No, can you do it? Okay, let's stay professional. Let's stay professional because I'll have you tell everybody about Klagenfurt. And the reason why I would like for you to do this now as I pull up the image for everybody is because now we've got a contrast here. We've got 3000 BC with Mesopotamia. uh and using dragons and then we have klagenfurt and klagenfurt is I'm going to call this modern there it is back up right there right there that is that is nuts and it's the story behind it uh go ahead christina this is a really cool story actually and for those that don't know klagenfurt is in austria And what we're looking at here is a statue that was created back in 1582. And according to the artist that made this, he said that he had to borrow the dragon skull from the castle in Austria in order to create this dragon. So what... what was attempted to be done was to create an accurate rendition of a dragon of the date at this time was unknown because there was no carbon dating back in the day. And so what we're looking at here is that rendition of what people thought dragons looked like all the way from 1582 up until I always say the last hundred, 150 years at most, because now the, Now we're aware, based off of the skull, which is right here, it's actually an Ice Age woolly rhinoceros. Based off of our understanding of paleontology and of carbon dating as well, that it's not a dragon skull, but instead a woolly rhinoceros. So you think that only woolly mammoths exist? No, we had rhinoceroses as well. And I think this has to be one of the coolest stories that I've come across when it comes to dragons solely because of the idea that the skull was a dragon and then creating a statue based off of that skull. And we are able to see very similar shapes here. And then the rest was kind of based off of historical accounts during the time. I'm sorry about that. Let me put that back up. Okay, so here it is. And a consistency that we're seeing are the wings, the legs, and a very long tail. Now, with this particular dragon, we are seeing four legs. With the Chinese dragons and some... Dragons from the UK, they only have two legs or no legs. Here we're seeing four, and it's not really a consistency with the more older ancient stories when it comes to dragons. Except for Usham Galu, which has four legs. And now here's the other part. Okay, you've got it up. This is 2700 BC. 2700 BC. Look at the size of this. Look at this. Isn't that beautiful? They found the head. The head is next to it. That's in another image. But let me pull this up like this. Yeah. Look at this thing. Is that incredible or what? It is. Usham Galu. And this was, I will, let me just, let me back out. Everybody, this is in real time, so you have to kind of go with us a little bit here. This is Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, yeah. Wait a minute. I just want to get, uh, this was October of 2023. Okay. That statue that was found. Yes. That statue. And, um. uh, to, to, to, uh, to the Eagles wings. Um, experts believe, okay, I'm trying to get the exact location because this photograph is from T Ron times. So I thought that it was in Iraq. Maybe it was in the press release or this newspaper article is from, uh, It's from Tehran, but I want to get the exact location here, and I'm not pulling it up right now at this time. Okay, so enough of that, but there's the image. There's the image. Now, let's- Now, so the local legend of Klagenfurt, this is what I just found so interesting, is the dating of this. Because this sculpture here is from 1582. And you're right, they used the skull of a woolly rhinoceros, right? But the local legend... says the mythical founding of the city in a marshy area plagued by a dragon which made crossing the river glan they called it the crossing of wailing because you was gonna die right so that's and so the local duke built a tower for safety hired knights to kill it you ready by fishing for it with a chain and a hook that connected the tower to a bull for bait. So they lured the dragon out of the river. After it took the bait, the knights surrounded it and killed it. The fountain was built in 1583 from a solid piece of slate from the local mountain. It still stands in Klagenfurt today in the town square. But check this out. That was 1583. The earliest coat of arms from Klagenfurt was from 1287 with a dragon. No way. Dun, dun, dun. I'm a dragon pillar of knowledge today. I'm a dragon pillar of knowledge. I wanted to mention one other thing, which is if you look at the descriptions from the Enuma Elish book, And the way Tiamat has described the Usham Galu, that you had the combination of dragon and lion. And if you look here, those look like lion's paws to me. Right. And those look like four lions legs. And I just I just I just find that really, really, really interesting. Now, the other part about this depiction here, which is from 1583, is also showing the the. I'm going to say bat wings, that type of wing depicted on the bat, but also on the pterodactyl. And this found its way over to Central and South America and throughout Europe and in China. Now, isn't that interesting? Also, Christina, you bring up a really good point. That in some stories, the description was the dragon, more like a Tyrannosaurus Rex, right? Walking on two legs, bipedal. with arms and then the wings separate. But they had arms. They could do their thing. They weren't four-legged. They were bipedal with arms and then the wings. Not like a bat, which has its hands on the wings. It was never done that way. Right? And bats are everywhere. So if you were going to enlarge a bat and turn that into a dragon, then why wouldn't you have hands on the wings? No, it's never been depicted that way. So is it possible right now? When was the first dinosaur fossil discovered? I know this one. I had to look it up, but I know this. I know this. Well, I don't know the exact date, but I have a reference point. It was in the 1800s. That's right. 1811, I think. Here in North America. Here? So, yeah, it was in Montana. So before that... What's that? Where's my shovel? I know, right? I know, I know, I know, I know. So why... Why didn't we, and especially now where so many dinosaur fossils are found in China, right? We find them in Siberia. We find them all over North America. Why did it take so long to make these discoveries? Yeah, that's the Chinese one right there. That's in China. And that's one of the most complete, complete pterodactyl skeletons I think ever found so far. And that's in China. I sound like I'm Darwin or some anthropologist. I'm not. It's just that I've been fascinated with this. uh, over the years and every time a new discovery like this. So you stop and you look at it and you go, wait a minute. I've seen this before. I've seen this in my, I've seen this in Sumerian. I've seen this in, in, in, uh, uh, coats of arms. I've seen this on above a tavern on, uh, you know, the sign, um, Jimmy is secretly a nerd. Um, I am. I love this stuff. I love jumping down. And when you get to a point, Christina, and I'm speaking directly to the audience here, when you keep looking at this over and over and over again, and you see the references in the fossil record, and then you see the mentions in culture, and you see it in coats of arms, you see it in flags, you see the stories, y ou see it in... I keep going back to the Enuma Elish. That is an old, old text mentioning dragons. And then you just go back and you match it up with the fossil record. What is it they were seeing? And... for all of us, when we started seeing dinosaur bones for the first time in the 1800s, we didn't even understand what we were looking at. We didn't know what dinosaurs were. They've never been seen. Now, there is also, and we can move on, there are depictions of dinosaurs, brontosaurus, stegosaurus, On cave walls, carved in stone. Now, guesswork, dreams, well, a stegosaurus, stegosaurus sculptures, little toys that are thousands of years old. If we allegedly didn't make the discovery of the first dinosaur fossils and skeletons until the 1800s, then what was it that was being depicted in ancient art and sculpture and put down in the historical record? Like with Pliny the Elder. That's the first century. right? That's 23 AD to 79 AD. He died in 79 AD. So right in the middle of the first century, right? What was going on then? Christianity? Most important questions that we have to ask. If it was depicted in cave art, then there has to be something to it. Or were their drawing skills just absolutely horrendous and we are the ones misidentifying it, right? The possibilities are endless with this. But to give more information and details about the image that we're seeing here, scientists from the National Museum Scotland had unveiled a remarkable 240-million-year-old fossil dubbed the Chinese Dragon in southern China, and the creature, which is named the Deinocyphalosaurus orentales, was a five meter long aquatic reptile with 32 separate neck vertebrae. And here's another image of what we think the dinosaur looks like. It looks kind of like an eel, but based off of the skeleton and the fossil alone, it's really beautiful to hear that they have dubbed it the Chinese dragon because that's exactly what it looks like. Now, imagine just for a moment, this... fossil was unearthed in the very early 1800s let's say the year 1800 there would be no thought of it being a dinosaur but instead a dragon and more so on top of that and I cannot emphasize this enough but eastern countries like china and japan and vietnam They hold a level of respect for dragons. Dragons are also protectors of homes. There are always statues in front of usually Buddhist temples. People buy them as well. It's a place in front of their homes. I have one here. It's a half dragon, half lion. But what's really interesting and what we're seeing consistently across these Eastern cultures is that it is the overall culture protector, prosperity, symbol of all of those beautiful and important things, more so than in the West, where, again, the mentality is kill it first, ask questions later. And for this Scottish Museum to find this back in 2003 is just something that I think adds an incredible layer to the conversation and the topics of Dragon's because there have been other fossils found over the decades, maybe even over the centuries, where people have mistaken them as dragons. And there are ideas here that those that have been looking into this very topic think that people that once saw a fossilized dinosaur bone, they miscategorized it as a dragon. What's actually something that I want to mention here rather quickly is that Chinese medicine back in... the first, second, and third century, there was this practice that if you find a fossilized bone, which they always believed to be dragons, is that if you were to create it into a powder, mix it with a few other herbs, it could heal you from dysentery, diarrhea, and it's almost like this level of not an immortality pill, but could protect you for years when it comes to illness, aging, and death. Now, to our understanding today, it seems as if these were just fossilized dinosaur bones, but the mentality just a few centuries ago was, nope, these are dragons, these are mystical creatures, and they will heal you and they will protect you. We also see this consistently in Chinese and Japanese legends, stories, TV shows that talk about the, usually like talking about the celestial realms, Where dragon scales, dragon horns, dragon blood, all these things have mystical powers to it. And we could even consider the, what's it called? Snow cone flavor, dragon's blood, right? That's a popular flavor as well. People really love it. Is that right? I've never had it. Is that a real thing? It's a real flavor. Yes. So you're five years old. You're five years old and you turn to your mom and you go, okay, I don't want you. I want dragon's blood today. You can do that. That's hardcore. Yeah. Wow. That is hardcore. I've got two things before we run out of time. We haven't far from discovered every dragon. form of dinosaur. No, no, it's lots, lots, lots. And, uh, that this, I remember posting this picture like 10 years ago. That is. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's, it's, this is one of my, uh, uh, most favorite images that I ever found on the web. It's incredible is that we, we have, we, we've got a lot more to discover, but just recently in China, uh, They have discovered an intact T-Rex skeleton. Are you ready? Covered in feathers. Right, right, right. So now through evolution, now this is okay. Now was every T-Rex covered in feathers? Now, that's an interesting thought. Obviously, what we are taught today is that the living dinosaurs are birds. Today, that's the direct descendants from dinosaurs. So let's back this up. What do you mean T-Rex with feathers? Did T-Rex fly? Did T-Rex have wings? Is this the dragon that, right, the mythical? That's where that gets really fascinating with me. And this is in the past year, by the way. So did every T-Rex have feathers? Well, if they did, why? Is there a species yet to be discovered that had wings? And the Tyrannosaurus rex? What's the one that flies? Triceratops. Pterodactyl. Pterodactyl. See, I'm not as smart as I say. The pterodactyl, when we look at the pterodactyl, is that a dragon? No. And who would have seen a pterodactyl to make that connection? Unless right. So as we wrap up, I want to ask you, Christina, do you believe in dinosaur or do you believe in dragons? Yeah. I do. I do. Did you hear me? Sorry. I mean, well, are you, are you apprehensive? You were apprehensive in your yes. Is it tough? It's not hard to believe in dragons. No, it's not. I think that we already know that dinosaurs are real. I don't see why we can't also think that dragons are real as well. And I want to hear your thoughts, but very quickly, Marty, thank you so much for that. And Mark, Jimmy, say his last name, please. Tazaka in the house. Tazaka. He believes in dragons. I mean, if you're watching this show here today or listening to it, there's a little inkling of belief in your heart or in your brain. And Legend, thank you so much as well. The Thunderbirds, yes, super cool topic. Jimmy and I have covered them before, and they're really interesting. But dragons are also very cool as well. Let me ask you, Jimmy, do you believe in dragons? I do. I do. There's just too much evidence there. There's too much evidence. And it seems to me that something was flying around, some flying reptile, until recent history. And that's, that's it. Now, can we go to, um, you know, the legend of, uh, of, of Klagenfurt or look at Pliny the elder, uh, Marco Polo that's recent history. Then we go back, you know, 4,000 years, 5,000 years in the Mesopotamia and the Enuma Elish and the Sumerian texts that actually use the word dragon, right? The direct translation is dragon. So were they seeing something that was alive? And we are too quick to dismiss this today, right? We're just too quick to just write it off. I just think that there is too much there. And Again, I don't think that there was a culture or a town or a country on this planet that doesn't have reference to it that did not have contact with the other. It's really that simple. So to see it depicted exactly the same and described exactly the same, to have Pliny the Elder or Marco Polo discuss something in the historical record that the Sumerian text discussed 3,000 years before they were alive. So, yeah, yeah, I believe in dragons, and I'm okay in saying it. There's definitely something to it. Now, the biggest question is, where are they today? That's the biggest question. Were they all slayed? Did they all just go extinct? Are they living in caves right now? Are they in some form of hibernation? And then maybe tomorrow or in 10, 50 years, they'll be flying in our skies again. Dragons eggs. What are we going to tell them? What if they hatch? What if they hatch? What if they hatch? Dragons eggs, right? You know, what if we pull the Jurassic Park? What if we do that? What if we start, you know, messing with DNA and doing that? Well, it's going to happen. They're doing it now, right? They are actually right now. trying to breed woolly mammoths. You know that. Right. Yeah. We know with the colossal company based in Texas. Yes. Yes. Yes. That is happening. Same with the dodo bird as well. And maybe a few other ones might be coming along the way. But you're right. It's in our future if to recreate these creatures that have gone extinct very much like Jurassic Park. And the sky's the limit. Are dragons going to be next if we are able to find a dragon egg? The answer to that is a big fat yes. I love it. These are exciting times. And to be able to use science today to match up with mythology, what we would always consider a mythological creature. You mentioned Thunderbirds. I'll wrap with this. As I get ready for Fade to Black tonight, we have Seth Shostak on the show tonight. And We'll be talking about SETI, and I've got to get ready for that. But when I was a kid, and this is something that I grew up with this wasn't, you know, some Grimm's fairy tales or some, some thing. No, there were Thunderbird sightings in Indiana. There was film that was shot. There was pictures that were taken. The local news was covering it. And my friends and I were going out Thunderbird hunting. We wanted to see Thunderbirds. So what was it that people were seeing? And the news reporting that was going on back then, the California condor, and there were mentions of the rarity of these species, that is it possible to have a giant condor still alive and flying over the state of Indiana? It wasn't just Indiana, but locally with me, Uh, it was Indianapolis and what was it that people were seeing the, the photographs in the, in the, in the video, the film was shot on film was just absolutely incredible. These were huge, giant birds. Now, if that could happen, then anything could happen. And I would not be surprised if we, we dig up and, and find a fossil, a skeleton of a dragon. And if we did, would that information be made public? Wouldn't it be cool if it was like in a cave with piles of gold coins? That'd be pretty cool. Yeah, that'd be pretty cool. Christina, thank you so much. Another amazing, fun show. You always put this stuff together. Thank you so much, Christina. I'll see everybody tonight. Today's my Friday. I can't wait to wrap this day so I can get into the weekend. I got my new Harley exhaust. being delivered tomorrow so I've got new exhaust coming for the bike so uh this is my christmas eve tonight so I get to spend christmas eve with you right now tonight with seth show stack and the rest of the fader knots and then I roll in tomorrow and put my new exhaust on my bike so I'll see everybody tonight on fade to black christina thank you so much you're the best Thank you. It's so fun talking about dragons. Like it's just the highlight of my day today. If you enjoyed the show, please hit that like button right down below. That is one of the best ways to support the channel and subscribe if you haven't already. As I do several shows right here every single week and tomorrow is going to be strangest news of the week. You don't want to miss it. 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