The SHOCKING UFO Encounter Revealed While Under Hypnosis

Show Transcript

We don't normally cover alien abductions on this channel with the exception of like Whitley Strieber and Travis Walton. But this case that we're going to be covering today really stands out as an equally incredible case with many very interesting angles. So in this episode, we will be covering an alleged encounter with extraterrestrials and their UFO being observed by a hunter in the forest while hunting for elk in Wyoming. Hello and welcome to this episode of Mysteries with a History, where you'll be taken on a wild ride into the unknown, the strange, and the mysterious. Like you, I have questions, and like you, I want answers. And with each episode together, we will peel away the layers to look for the truth. Let me bring in my co-host, Jimmy Church of Faded Black Radio. Jimmy, happy Thursday. It's like a little bit in the background. No, I was swallowing coffee. You know, I got it. I got to be on my game for this. Well, and especially today, Christina. Hello, everybody. How's everybody doing? The the way back machine. You're going way back into a case, cases, let's go plural, that many probably don't know about. But when they broke, and we'll get into it in a second, but they were a sensation across the United States. This was like a really big deal. And there was a lot of, I don't want to use the word hysteria, but there was a lot of things that were happening there. Around this time, nineteen seventy two, seventy three, seventy four, seventy five, seventy six, which is where these cases fall into and they overlap. But it's the way back machine. So I have to ask you, how do you stumble? These are two of my favorite cases. So this particular case, it actually happened when I was reading through some UFO books kind of like last week as well. And I was like, oh my gosh, this one is good. We have to cover it. Both are good. Both are great cases. And so that's what you were doing. You were just doing some rabbit holing. I was just kind of like in my spare time doing a little bit of reading, catching up on a few things. And I said, this is all we got to cover. I do the same thing. I'm sure that most of us do. I'll be reading a book or, you know, just and go, wait a minute. What is that? So I'll, you know, write on the internet and go and review. Oh, that's right. Okay. And then go down that thread and it leads you to other places. I do it all the time. I don't pretend to know that I know every single, I'm not like Michael Shratt, right? Or Richard Dolan, right? Linda Moulton Howe, where they've got this incredible recall. They've got all this research and they can go back and they've got the names and the dates and the locations. I don't pretend to know it all. I know a lot. But these two cases here are two of my favorites. And when it's a chat or a guest that will talk about different things, these two cases should be talked about and they're not. They definitely should. And I think you got to start off with number one, since it dates back just a year prior to a case to a very famous case. But this first one, I don't feel like it's well known enough. And I'm referring to the Pat McGuire encounter. And he was actually let me share my screen here. Let me share an image of what this man looks like. While I do that, Jimmy, give us a slight rundown of who this man was and where his encounter took place. Well, okay. So before, let me, I'm going to do the same exact thing. Before we go and pull all of this stuff up, we are talking about cowboy country. Right. And so Wyoming, Montana, those areas up there where there is a lot of ranching, a lot of remote areas and so forth. And so when you look up into this area, it's it's so wide open that I say this a lot, but if you're E.T. and you come to Earth. do you go to New York city, right? Or do you go to Canada? Do you go to Montana? Do you go to Wyoming where you can do stuff and not be detected or reported? And that seems like a smart thing to do, which takes us to this case because, um, and, and Leo sprinkle, we have to bring him into this too, as well. Um, where he goes in, he researches, he does some hypnosis, some therapy. And this case, Boesler, Montana, he, Pat McGuire was, and it's MCG, McGuire, has a ranch up there that's five thousand acres. And so he was on a hunting trip. And this is the other thing. And when you go and look up this case, it's multiple contact events. You've got sightings. You've got photographs. You've got cattle mutilations. You've got contact. And you've got witnesses. And that's what Pat McGuire's case involved. And so Leo Sprinkle comes in. And starts investigating. McGuire says he's seeing lights streaking across the sky. He finds one of his cattle that's been mutilated. And then everything just takes off from there. It was a lot of contact that spanned a long time. It did. It did. And with McGuire in particular, it's very strange because he had, as you had mentioned, Jimmy, multiple UFO sightings, cattle mutilations on his five thousand acre ranch. And he claimed to have witnessed lights in the sky, hovering spacecraft and even shadowy figures inside of these craft. But as we always hear, why didn't this man take photos? Why don't we have any videos? He attempted. He did. He did. According to him, he was unable to capture clear evidence. But it just got more intense when his friend, Jimmy Ashley, allegedly touched a landing spacecraft and was engulfed in flames without being harmed. So with all of this taking place on this poor man's ranch. McGuire filed a report with the Aerial Phenomena Resource Organization back in nineteen seventy six, stating that extraterrestrial talking about extraterrestrial visits and then that it that became a regular occurrence on the ranch because this took place between nineteen seventy three all the way to nineteen seventy seven. And he claimed to have a vision that led him to find water in his drought-stricken ranch, which I would remember that. That's going to be very important information because he had consistently looked across his five thousand acres trying to find water and he wasn't able to. But it's almost as if he got this telepathic message of you need to dig here, dig right there. So we did exactly that. And he was able to find about a five thousand gallon area of fresh water once he dug three hundred and fifty feet. But this is where a lot of skepticism came through, mainly from his family, actually, that said, how did you know this information? Who's telling you this? Oh, you really believe in aliens and UFOs? You're out of your mind. You're insane. So it got so bad for him when he was telling the world about how he has contact with star people is how we classified them. That's right. And Leo Sprinkle comes in this conversation and we're going to get back to him. So write that name down. He starts investigating Mr. McGuire right here. And tells him to go under regression hypnosis. And there he goes into a bit more detail on not only the craft, but the beings that he encountered. Because he stated that these beings were about six feet tall with distinct features, large eyes and hairless bodies. And they claimed to have warmed in, warned him about a future climate catastrophe and provided guidance on various matters, including where to dig his successful well and a few other things. But it was getting so intense that he ended up getting a divorce with his wife because not even his wife believed him. He remarried and then he had thirteen children. through the guidance from these star people. But it just gets more interesting because then in nineteen eighty two, they're like, you should run for governor. You should do this, that and the other. So what does McGuire do? He's like, that's a fantastic idea. He told me where the water was, told me to remarry, told me to have thirteen kids. I did all of those things. Right. Let's run for governor. And it actually didn't go well. He had mentioned that he has this extraterrestrial support, which doesn't run well back in the nineteen eighties so much, especially in a state such as Wyoming. And then he ended up actually dying without a penny to his name at the age of sixty seven in two thousand and nine. And this is all leading up to the next case we're going to cover. Well, let's say, well, OK, hold on. Hold on. We can't get off of Pat McGuire yet. Let's stay right here for a second because he got so excited. Nineteen seventy three, him and his brother, they're out there doing their thing. They're they're they're cowboys, right? They're ranchers and they see an orange glow in the sky. And that was nineteen seventy three, nineteen seventy four. Another sighting at the beginning of September, streaking lights across the sky, stopping over the ranch. A week later in September, lights were spotted again. Later on in September, more lights, cattle mutilations. They were doing head counts and started to see that the numbers were off in their cattle. And all of this is happening. And then he comes out and he says, hey, hey, you guys got to understand. My ranch is a UFO landing site. UFOs landed. They used my rant. And I got to tell you, Basler is a town. It's called Basler. It's got population of ten. That's it. That's it. That's all that's there. So he's the one doing the reporting. And you're right about that. How he described the aliens. He tried to take pictures. He's got his other workers that are with him and his brother that are all seeing these sightings at the same time. This continued for a long time, all the way through to nineteen eighty one, nineteen eighty two. The headline, the local papers there. He was a I'm going to say this. He was like a local celebrity. Uh, the population's very small, but right, right, right, right. But he's the, the, the media was covering this story and, and covering him. So he was a local celebrity for sure. And so when he decides to run for governor Christina in, in the early eighties, um, and with, uh, his, his main supporters for his, his run, uh, We're aliens. And that too as well. That too as well. But this turns around and makes headlines. And the National Enquirer comes in and puts them on the cover. I have an alien base on my ranch. And yeah, yeah, this was a really, really, really big story. It was a fun read for quite a long time. I always liked the guy. Um, he, I just thought he was very personable and, and, and he, he was, he was great. And it was, it was headlines for, for about ten years here in the United States. That's impressive. And this, it seemed that it laid a foundation for the next case that we're going to be covering, which is the Carl Higdon case that took place October We aren't able to get a full grasp of this encounter without talking about Pat McGuire. But now that we're focusing on Mr. Higdon here, this is a remarkable case because we're dealing with a lot of similarities. And I'm going to lay those down for you. You have contact with extraterrestrials, UFO sightings, strange things in the area. Dr. Leo Sprinkle is there yet again doing his investigations. He was a UFO researcher. Then you have regression hypnosis. And you seem to also have this connection between an altered state of consciousness, these telepathic-type messages as well. And actually, I'm just going to hold off on the next thing I want to mention for a little bit later and talk to you about what happened. Because... he was found almost in a state of like being unconscious. He wasn't entirely, but his mind wasn't fully there on the night of October, twenty fifth, nineteen seventy four, when he was going to do some elk hunting at the Medicine Bow National Forest in Wyoming. And There was this mission where his, and I believe it was his wife. His wife said, my husband's missing. Can he go look for him? And so they ended up finding forty one year old Carl Higdon Junior, who was a oil well digger and who had radioed his location earlier that day because it's so important to always tell people where you're going to be. And then at about eleven forty p.m., they found Higdon in a state of absolute confusion, unable to recognize his wife and repeatedly shouting about missing elk, which is odd. And his behavior was so erratic that his wife requested his rifle to be removed from his reach. But it only gets more intense. We haven't gotten to the good part yet. No, no, no, no. You just barely, this case has it all. And I just interrupted you, Christina, and I apologize for that. But I want everybody to understand, and going back to McGuire, we are talking about hardcore cowboy roughneck men. These are men's men. And they don't do the UFO thing. Their life is, is nature and ranch and cattle and oil. And that's it. It doesn't go into the fantastical. Why you are a hard OG cowboy and you are stable and you need to be looked at by all of the other cowboys and roughnecks and oil men in the area. You can't be the alien UFO guy. You can't be the ghost guy. You can't be the unstable. No, that is not how they roll. That's why Pat McGuire is so special to this story. And Higdon. it's nuts to me. And it reminds me a little bit of like Blind Frog Ranch. And, you know, my interviews with those that are involved there, we're talking about guys from Texas, you know, Montana, Wyoming, Idaho. This is a different, this is a different place than our community is used to going to and dealing with and the individuals that are involved. Uh, Higdon Higdon was hardcore McGuire. These are hardcore. He was, let me, let me paint this picture. He was a foreman on an oil rig. Do you know what kind of hard, I say hardcore, you are, right? That to be a foreman on an oil rig in Rollins, that's it. That's who we're talking about here. So I painted that picture. I interrupted you. Let me hand it back to you. Or I can go through and start laying this out. Wait, before we get into the actual things of what he saw, let me just state this. So after he was found in the National Forest, totally confused, had no idea what was going on, couldn't even recognize his wife, and they've been married for several decades by that time frame, he was quickly rushed to the Carbon County Memorial Hospital to get an understanding of what's going on with this man, what happened, why is he so confused, right? So he arrived at the hospital at two a.m. And he was even unable to recall his own name. What's your name, sir? Yeah, I actually don't know. Who's the lady next to you? I also have no idea who she is. Do you know who she is? So that was already confusing. But when he was in the hospital, and for anyone that's ever been in there, you know how bright it is, how intense the lights can be. They were so intense to him, Carl Higdon, that he was just complaining that it was causing him this significant discomfort. And then... Physicians come in, they take a look at him. They don't find anything wrong with him. But what they do find is very remarkable. He had these scars on his lungs from tuberculosis. And when they did an x-ray on him, they checked him out. Those scars had seemingly disappeared. He also had kidney stones and those seemingly disappeared as well. And looking at this, he's in the hospital, he's getting this information, and he couldn't be more confused. He didn't know his name, he didn't know his wife, and now he found out that these ailments that he had were just miraculously healed. I mean, for starters, during this time frame, I don't know if we can even do it today, healing scars from, like, the inside of your body, that takes time to do. If it ever gets healed or goes away. Scar tissue is scar tissue. Exactly. Yeah, yeah. And for him, they weren't there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He if we go back. OK, so we we jump forward in in this and to get everybody understanding what we're talking about here. This is a well-documented case. Everybody was involved. That includes his family, his company, the hospital, the local law enforcement. and and so forth um so yes christina mentioned um that he was elk hunting he was a forum a foreman on uh on an oil rig and it was october twenty fifth nineteen seventy four where everything kicked off and I'm gonna officially say this was a close encounter of the fourth kind And as I talk about this, what is interesting about this case, when we go back to that time of and everything was flying saucers and rockets, the craft that he was taken on and I'll get to it in a second, but he describes it as a cube. Okay. Now that's that right there. And so let's, let's, let's jump into this a little bit. He four kids. Right. I've classified him as a rough neck and that's what, uh, you know, oil, oil workers are called, uh, uh, fifteen years. He was an air force veteran of the Korean war. Um, he was dubbed the Wyoming coyote by his crew for his ability to keep at everything and never give up until he got things done. Look at his picture. That's that's that's what I mean. So he says that he borrowed the company truck. He headed forty miles south for McCarty Canyon. When the road got rough, he parked and took off on foot at about four p.m. He got to the top of a ridge, spotted five elk. Now, this is where for me that the whole story, because this gets recalled later in the hospital that Christina was just talking about. But he's hunting elk. So he comes up to the top of this ridge. He spots five elk grazing. He lifts up his gun, which was a seven millimeter magnum rifle, and takes a shot. That's the last thing he remembers. Okay, that's it. He doesn't really remember pulling the trigger. The next thing that he knew, it was eleven thirty p.m. Friends were shaking him to wake up and who had found him sitting in his truck. So he goes from being on top of this ridge to being in his truck. The last thing he remembers is pointing at this elk and planning on pulling the trigger. So all he remembers is passing out, blacking out. So later that night, he's at Carbon County Memorial Hospital, and the nurse, and we have her name, it was Ella Peterson, asked him about his name, which Christina just talked about. He didn't remember anything, didn't recognize his wife. His wife's name was Marjorie. But his eyes were red, and he couldn't see. They were watering, they were burning, and this goes back to his close encounter. We'll get to that. So he starts to get his memory back, Christina. And then he says, I do remember pulling the trigger, but there was no kickback on the rifle. Right. And that nothing happened. The bullet exited the gun in slow motion. And then he dropped to the ground or the bullet dropped to the ground about fifty feet in front of him. And then his wife said, that's crazy. Right. What are you talking about? Then while going through his clothes. right she found the bullet in his jacket pocket it was turned inside out and flattened but it was there she had the she had the bullet but it was at she thought it must have struck a hard object Ballistics experts were unable to explain how the bullet could turn inside out and flatten like it did. They didn't have an explanation for that. And again, he said the bullet exited the gun in slow motion. And instead of going, you know, a normal bullet, it dropped to the ground, fifty feet in front of him. He goes over, picks it up, puts it in his shirt pocket. He goes to the hospital. Later on, when he's at home, his wife is doing laundry. She's doing laundry. He's like, what's that? Empty in the pocket. And then that's when the flattened bullet was found. All of this is just crazy. Now he goes through a Leo sprinkle comes in. He goes through several sessions of hypnosis and he starts to recall everything and it never changed. There's Leo sprinkle right there. Great, great researcher. And so. Oh, I'm going to say this. I'm going to go to the very end of the, well, not the end end, but this was the only ET contact for Carl. And I find that, you know, it's not like the story got bigger or other things happened or other encounters or other sites. No, none of that ever happened. Um, but his story never changed for decades now. This is what he says. He says he pulls the trigger of the gun and gets knocked to the ground. He doesn't know how, but he looks up and he sees this ET standing over him about six feet tall. And he says, wait about a hundred and eighty pounds. There's the picture right there. This is incredible. And he said that he didn't know if it was male or female, but he assumed that it was male. He said the skin was yellow, had no ears, very small eyes that were deep set. He said the mouth was thin and lipless with an open slit from which three large blocky teeth were visible. He said that two short antennae that you can see here in this drawing. This is a really good drawing, by the way. He had antennae. coming off of his head now was that growth was that part of the or was it something else don't know okay we don't know um the hair on the being's head was like straw and stood straight up Kind of like me in the nineteen eighties in Hollywood. If you want to cop a visual with that. But anyway, he said that he wore a tight black jumpsuit. Again, that is illustrated here. He said it was similar to a diving suit that a diver would wear. Um, he had a pair of, uh, he described them as seat belts and a metal belt with a yellow star decoration on his waist. Again, you can see it here in this drawing instead of a right hand, the creature possessed, uh, uh, uh, like a power drill instead of a hand. And you can see it here, right here. That's his right hand had a drill on it. Some, something mechanical, um, uh, was installed on the end of his right arm. And, uh, the alien says, are you ready in English? Who are you looking down at him? And he's, you know, so he's taking it all in. He's looking at the creature. He's looking at the stuff and looking at his right hand, the antenna, the yellow straw hair. And the alien says, who are you? Right. And, uh, how are you? Are you okay? Higdon replies. I'm pretty good. He said his hands were shaking. He was nervous. He was scared. He was trying to stay calm. And he said, then the alien introduced himself as also one, a U S S O O N E also one, uh, Also one said to him, which goes back to the hospital, but let's stay here for a second. He said, your son burns us. And then he offered Carl a bag full of pills and there were four pills and, uh, and they said it was for nourishment and Higdon swallowed one. Now, And it's at this part of, of Carl's, uh, encounter where for me, I stepped back and said, would I take a pill from a stranger? Right. Would I swallow it? I'm going to throw that at you, Christina. Would you ET gives you four pills. He says they're for nourishment. Are you taking one? I don't think so. No, no, you're not. I'm not. I have trust issues. I would not probably. You know who I take pills from? My mom. And even then, right? Even then, there's questions, right? So, but he takes one of the pills, and he said that... the same, my response, he said he didn't, he didn't like to take pills and he didn't even like taking aspirin, but for some reason he took this one pill from this alien. Now then also one says, Hey, you want to go for a ride in my ship? Right. And now this is what also one says. You laugh. He says, dude, And, and Carl looks over and the ship, are you ready? It was a cube, not a flying saucer, not round, not a rocket ship, not an airplane, not a cigar shape, nothing that we are used to reading about in the media, seeing in movies and everything else that the ship was a cube. And what does Higg didn't say? Just like taking the pill. I'm down. He does. He literally says, sure, let's go. So, um, Carl says that the cube ship was windowless, didn't have any doors, um, and was too small for him to fit into, but somehow he was transported inside along with also one. Um, and two other alien creatures. And so, uh, in total, um, uh, there was those four and are you ready? The five elk that he was shooting at. So they all get into this little cube ship, right? We, so you got three aliens, you've got Carl and five elk. Right. Why are you laughing? This is, this is, this is good stuff, man. This is first person. This is, you know what I mean? Close encounters. It's like a TARDIS. Yeah. It is a TARDIS, right? It is a TARDIS. And how many times, now this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, So we've got this coming from Carl in nineteen seventy four. He said that the trip. That they took. Was to also one's planet, and he said it took less than one minute, although also one told him and this is an oil rig worker. And I find this part completely strange and compelling. that it was one hundred and sixty three thousand light years away. And the trip only took one year. He said they arrived at dark on the planet. They landed near a tower with a flashing light on the top. And he said that the light on the top of the tower was so bright that it hurt Higgins eyes. Okay, again, we got to remember that. He said that the tower looked like Seattle's Space Needle. He said it was conical in shape, about a hundred feet tall, and made a buzzing sound. Now, he went on to say, Christina, I know that I'm rambling here, but this case is just fascinating to me. He said that surrounding the tower, there were more human-like beings, about a half a dozen. He described them as one was a middle-aged man, one was a young girl, two teenage girls, and a teenage boy standing around just talking. at the base of this tower. He said that also floated out of the craft and brought Higdon with them, floated him out into the tower and up an elevator. They entered a room where Higdon stood on a platform. Now check this. This is the best part of the story. There's some good stuff here. There's some good stuff. He said that this device comes out of the wall and Scans his body. This is nineteen seventy four. Remember, and then retracted back into the wall. You know what happens next? Also turned to him and said. You're not what we're looking for. Bummer, right? Sounds like a Tinder date. That's awful. You're not right. You know, so Osso floats him back to the cube and takes him back to Earth. Yeah. I mean, rejection at its finest. Yes. Yes. One hundred and sixty three thousand light years away. And and you get the thumbs down. He said that Osso told him. That his people, now this is all very, very interesting to me. The whole encounter is interesting. He said that also told Higdon that his people would explore Earth at various times. They would come here to find animals to breed for food. Also told him of a different sun and seas on their planet. We're inadequate for supporting life. Doesn't that remind, it makes you think of climate change here, right? Because right now things are pretty cool. They're getting out of control, but we're still good, right? But it's the future. Could things get out of whack on this planet and not support life? And if we were out on another planet and we would share that story, our sun is whack, right? Our planet is whack and it doesn't support life anymore. But this was nineteen seventy four. So I just find that part of his story very, very interesting. The message wasn't you need to save your planet. you know, you, you're pollution, nuclear, this wars and that you need to save your, no, that's not what also said. He said that they came here because they needed food. Isn't it that interesting that their planet, their sun and their seas could no longer support life. And what do we have here? Droughts and, and water shortages and the concern that we have here. Um, so after the body scanning, um, they, they come back to earth and also pointed to his drill hand zoom in zoom in that's the drill hand. Okay. and, and pointed at Higdon's pocket with the drill hand and floated, uh, the remaining package of pills back to that. There they are. That's a blister pack. And, uh, but, uh, uh, also one took the pills back and then he gave Higdon back his rifle. Higdon says he somehow managed to make it back to his truck and get inside, was very confused. That's where rescuers found him just before midnight. But the truck, Christina, was not in the same position that he had originally parked it. He said that it was further into the rugged area, three miles away from where he had parked it. And that, uh, it was a two wheel drive truck and there's no way it could have managed to drive into this rugged area, but check this out. The rescuers that found him said that there were no tire tracks. His truck was just resting there where they found it. There were no tire tracks leading up to that park spot. And again, another compelling part, uh, to, to this case. So now let me, let me jump forward and then I'll hand this back to you. Back at the hospital, you talked about all of this, about his tuberculosis scars, which ravage people's lungs, right? Those scars were no longer visible with x-rays, and his kidney stone issue apparently was gone. But aside from his eyes... He was in great shape, right? His scars were gone. His kidney stones were gone. Now, the local media comes in and covers this case. Publications across the country, the San Antonio Star being one of them. And it was front page news across the country in nineteen seventy five. I read this story myself when it broke. But Higdon, one of his quotes, and you can see it in the newspaper article that you posted up there. This quote is in there. Life is not the same since I met that man. And there you go. But this is the other part of the case. That was it. They never came back. He wasn't what they were looking for. He never had another close encounter, never saw anything in the sky, nothing. This was his first one and only, uh, close encounter event. And while that might have been the case, according to him, he had mentioned that he did experience these very vivid, like dream episodes that he felt that he was present in multiple locations simultaneously. And he claimed to have developed a quote feeling for when UFOs would be near and reported subsequent sightings of lights in the sky with his family as well. And he, He also mentioned, and probably one of the biggest things about this, that we've heard in many respects, but not all cases, when it comes to these, would we classify this as an abduction? Because he was invited onto the craft. But is it still an abduction before I even continue? Well, they said, also one said, dude, you want to go for a ride? And he was like, I'm down. And so he was invited. So is that an abduction now? Uh, okay. So now let's take it to the abduction level. Going for a ride is going around the block. Right. going for a ride to me is not leaving this planet for another star system. That's a, that's a whole, but that to us is a long distance, hundred and sixty-three thousand light years and so forth. Um, but, uh, Higdon Higdon said that that only took a minute to get there. So a ride to ET is not the same thing that we would think about. Right. what a ride is so but yes so is that does that move to the level of abduction well he went under his you know he said yes he agreed to it and it was only a minute to the planet he gets rejected it's he's not what they're oh oh oh oh let me ask you this Christina what do you think they were looking for Maybe it was for breeding. Maybe they see humans. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. No, no, no, no. Kind of whack. Right. Really in real life. Right. Right. Now, don't you think that also one should have known male from female. Right. Um, How did also one make that mistake? Or was it, I don't know, humans? You are not what we're looking for when they did the scan. said to me immediately uh breeding right that they were looking for a female why didn't they know that first well um uh humans uh are not the only species on this planet and there are plenty species on this planet where you can change your sex there are plenty that can do that And some can reverse. Some are asexual, right? Where it's not necessarily a male-female situation that we have with Homo sapiens and other mammals. So maybe they were looking for that to see that if he could, right, be part of a hybrid program. But he couldn't. He couldn't. He was Homo sapiens. Maybe they were looking for that. You never know. You never know. But I just always found that very interesting. What is it that they were scanning for? Were they looking for eggs? Right? I don't know. It was very strange. But he got rejected. And they brought him back. So was that an abduction? I'm not so sure. It's like it could be classified either way, right? It might be. And I just quickly looked up if Carl Higdon had children, because maybe that was important, right? He had four kids. He had four kids. Right, right. So I was like, maybe that could have been a factor. Maybe he was infertile, right? And the scan figured that out. But I had to look it up just to make sure and it didn't seem like that was the case. But this is a pretty remarkable account. It's one that when talking about these close encounters, you have to address it because you're dealing with so much here. Dealing with a craft, an entity, healing of wounds as well, or just like better health. And then you have the evidence of this bullet that was analyzed by those that are familiar with weaponry and things like this. And they couldn't even explain how his rifle was able to create the strange anomalies that it did. Inside out. Inside out, inside out. And so now let's go back to Pat McGuire for a second. This is all in that general area. We have Pat McGuire went on the record and he said this on ABC eyewitness news. He said that UFOs had landed on his property. Twenty five or thirty times. Right. So were those, uh, contact experiences on McGuire's ranch, the same ET extraterrestrial, uh, uh, civilization that had the encounter with Carl, Carl Higdon. I think that they're related, you know, and, and they, all of this happened during the same time period, geographically, the same place. Yes, I went ahead and I looked up where these two people had their encounters only about an hour away from each other. Or if you don't live in the States and you're like, what the heck does an hour mean? About fifty eight miles apart from each other. That's right. That's right. Yeah. About the size of Pat McGuire's ranch. Think about it. And it's, uh, so yes, all of this was going down, same place, same time and Cowboys, you know, it's, it's like very, very strange. And for everybody that's listening to us right now, uh, go, uh, And we've given you all the data. Go and look these cases up. Go and do your own research and look into this. It's a fascinating part of ufology. The media, there's tons of newspaper reports that you can go and look at. There are photographs, there are videos, there are interviews. It's just a fascinating, fascinating part of our community. It is. And before we actually finish, I do want to state this, that his wife, okay, actually, let me back it up. So Carl Higdon passed away January of twenty twenty two at the age of eighty eight in twenty seventeen. His wife finally wrote the book of his encounter. His encounter took place in nineteen seventy four. The book didn't come out until twenty seventeen. I felt like that was a significantly long time to tell the world or in this case to lay it down straight of what happened. And. I just twenty seventeen just seems so. Too far away from the original encounter. Right. Right. Living in like twenty nineteen. Right. Right, right, right, right. And, uh, and to pull this back into, and you're right about that because the book came out in. And, uh, Marjorie Higdon, uh, Carl's wife who decided to write the book. it's so distant from nineteen seventy four. But if you go back to that time period, seventy three, seventy four, all the way to nineteen eighty one, eighty two, these cases, both Pat McGuire and Carl Higdon were were documented in the media. There were plenty of reporters that were covering this and journalists and and news programs from around the country that were continuing to to cover this case because it was so fascinating. You throw in Leo Sprinkle, you throw in law enforcement, you throw in the hospital, the nurse, and everything else that is involved here, including coworkers. There's a lot of documentation in both of these cases. Carl Higdon's case was covered. It was covered deeply. And it's probably one of the reasons why this isn't stretching into a case like Roswell or Betty and Barney Hill, is that Carl stayed out of the limelight. He didn't pursue any of that. He didn't write a book in nineteen seventy five. That didn't happen until two thousand and seventeen. So that's why I think these cases, although well documented, aren't cases that we talk about first. And we should, Christina. That's a really good point. He did not want to be famous. He didn't want to be known as that UFO guy, especially living in a town or in a state like Wyoming, having the job that he did. He just wanted to do his job, pay his bills, and take care of his family. The last thing he wanted to talk about was his experience, and maybe because... This book was written in twenty seventeen. I think it correlates well with all of the things that were happening in twenty seventeen, especially with that report by released by The New York Times talking about a tip. Right. So maybe that might have encouraged her, the wife, to write the book on his encounter. Maybe she felt like the world was ready for them to know what really happened. I mean, there are a handful of possibilities of why she waited so long to write it. But simultaneously, I'm thinking, with that much time, a little over forty years of just sitting on the case, some things, some details can get a little blurry. The ridicule... And when you're talking about, again, I'm going roughnecks and cowboys and the image that is there. To go public with this kind of stuff is completely opposite to the way that they live their daily lives. And when the ridicule starts to set in and you get pointed at, when you're amongst these groups, it's a tough thing to deal with. And Pat McGuire said some pretty sensational things. And so did Carl. But McGuire... Back in the early seventies, there was the six day war with Israel and McGuire stated, and again, this is, this is from memory, but he stated that he felt that he had implants put into his brain and And that he could go into other people's bodies, including the prime minister of Israel during the Six-Day War, Ariel Sharon. And he said that he was transported into Ariel Sharon's body during the Six-Day War. He didn't know if aliens put the implants into his brain or that maybe the government, because of his ET contact, had put implants into his brain. And this is where, you know, the ridicule is going to increase and it's going to get out of control. But he chose to make this statement as extraordinary as it is. We're talking about a rancher in Wyoming, right? It's, it's just a crazy part of this case and that he was able to transport himself into other people's bodies. That's insane. Actually, it reminds me of one book that I used to love in my teen years called Every Day. It feels like that book in particular, but that's actually all the time that we have for today. Jimmy, who do you have on Fade to Black? I've got the one and only Michael Schrat on the show tonight. Michael Schrat is with us. We are going to be talking about crash retrievals. He's one of the best researchers out there when it comes to this subject and his amount of documents and his knowledge of the subject. But right now, Christina, you know the way that this UFO community works. And right now, the hot topic is our government And are they in possession of off-world vehicles that are not from this planet? And are they backwards engineering those craft, trying to take advantage of ET tech? So Michael Schratt, one of the great researchers out there, tonight he's going to present his favorite cases, and coming from him, we do always need to take note, his favorite cases that represent what may be the possible crash retrievals, and the backwards engineering of those craft to exploit ET technology. So that's what we're going to do tonight on Fade to Black. Christina, another great show. Everybody, go. Pat McGuire, go and do it. Carl Higdon, two of the great cases in ufology. Christina, I'll see you later. Behave and be well. Bye, everybody. Bye. Thank you. What another great show and Android ending it strong. Thank you so much for that. And actually, I didn't even know that was the case. That's insane. If you enjoyed the show, hit the like button right down below. Subscribe if you haven't already. And I'm telling you, hit that notification bell because tomorrow, Friday, We're going to be doing a live Q&A, kind of a hangout as well. I rarely do those. Actually, I only do them once a year. But I said, you know what? Let's do it tomorrow. Let's have a little bit of fun, right? So you do not want to miss it as it will be live. And there you can submit your questions as well. Also, I do write articles for all of the shows right here. You can find them on my website. That link is in the description box below. And if you want to speak with like-minded people, sharing your thoughts, your insights, your experiences, or more, come over to my Discord server with almost four, three, someone will tell me how many members we have because on the top of my mind, I can't remember. I think it's a little under four thousand members. And you can just type in Strange Paradigms or find that link in the description box below. Lastly, my last little piece of information is that For my Patreon members, we will be doing a live get-together November ninth, I believe. 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