Sean Cahill on USS Nimitz CSG UFO Sightings - Classics Remastered

Show Transcript

This remastered interview includes bonus content of additional questions and answers originally made available only to members of Cristina's Patreon members club. So I wanted to get started by asking you between 1995 and 2004 before you saw the Tic-Tac object while serving on the Princeton did you ever hear accounts from others in the service regarding UFOs or were the events of that night your first exposure to the phenomenon? The closest I had come to that point to hearing anything official, you know, not just a story about something someone may have seen in their lifetime, (00:45) you know, something that was that made more sense. I or made sense to what I thought was the zeitgeist at the time was a friend who was a security police in a portion of what everybody else calls area 51 and I thought that was really neat and interesting and that was before the the satellite photos had been declassified a very 51 and we all knew that it was a real place beyond that just other people's anecdotal sightings but nothing nothing official whatsoever. (01:17) So Dixon has a question he says, "Hashon, seen Biden's first UAP response?" I haven't. I actually a friend of mine texted me the video clip of it and I haven't had a chance to watch it yet. No. When what you saw witness on the bridge wing in the sky that night must have really shocked you as things were happening. (01:38) Can you recall what was going through your mind as you were watching these objects do their movements and then disappear? It was, you know, I often tell the story of my wife comment the other day she goes, "You tell it the same every time." You know, it was five to seven lights off the port bow about 45 degrees up and I think about 2000 feet in elevation moving towards the center together and then each of them blinking out and at the time I just I didn't know what the heck I was looking at. I mean I had gathered a little bit by that point (02:13) we hadn't had any open discussions that we were chasing a UFO per se but it had been kind of thrown around that that's what we were. That's what these were. You know, we didn't know what they were and they were flying around, et cetera. So during the time this was happening, there were already rumors being thrown around of what it could be. Oh sure. Yeah. (02:35) Yeah. I mean Kevin and I I'd asked him a couple of times. Senior Chief Kevin Day. What are we doing here? And I mean I knew that we were looking for something that we couldn't identify and we were at first we were trying to determine whether or not they were real or whether they were ghosts in the radar so to speak. But then later on when it was obvious we were if we were going to sorty jets after them they were real. (02:58) You know, so then seeing that that in the sky it just didn't compute if you know if you know what I mean. There's nothing that should have moved and acted like that where we were whatsoever. Another super chat and it says how likely is that military has already attempted or will attempt efforts to communicate with the phenomenon. What would what would that look like? You know, I I couldn't hazard a guess as to the military doing it. (03:30) I don't think that it's their job to to open up diplomatic communications or communications of any kind like that. I would say that if people were interested in ways that the government or the government entities have tried to communicate with the phenomenon they might want to dig deeper into some of the data that's come out of skin walk or ranch. (03:47) So you weren't alone in seeing these objects. Do you remember the reaction of the other person on Outlook with you? Look out with you. Yeah, it was a young gentleman. I can't remember his name. But I turned to him and I said, "Did you see I looked in Devni?" I said, "Did you see that?" And he was looking back at me mouth open and eyes wide and he nodded and he said, "Yes Chief, I did. (04:11) " And that there really wasn't a lot more to say. It was that incredible that we were just kind of like going like that. And I walked into the bridge and went about the rest of my watch. I don't think Kevin was on watch, so I didn't call him at the time. I spoke to him the next morning at breakfast when he he told me that we received the gun camera footage in the over the cipranet the night before. (04:34) And have you kept in touch with that Outlook the lookout person by any chance? Or have you contacted you since? No, he has not identified himself or reached out. I didn't know who it was. It was a watchstander who at the time I was the Chief Master at Arms on the ship and that watchstander would have been someone who had just gotten on board within the last couple of months. (04:54) It was a very it was a junior watch station. And looking through what's called my cruise book, which is kind of like a yearbook for the ship during that period, I couldn't find the face that I recognize and remember. So it's going to be up to him to go, oh, I was there with him. And I'll know if it was him or not. I remember exactly what he looked like. (05:15) During your interview on the CNN earlier this week, you mentioned that objects were displaying characteristics that would put them technologically anywhere from between 100 to a thousand years ahead of us. Was that statement based upon what you saw with your own eyes? Or was it observed on radar and captured on video or all of the above? I would have to say all of the above. (05:39) One of the first things that Luis talked about with me when he interviewed me over the phone a few years ago was about those characteristics in the sky. And it was very helpful to him to hear someone describing some of the five observables, even though they didn't know about the five observables yet. (05:56) So it was another triangulation of data, you can say. We had radar data, we had pilot data, we had camera data. Now we had eyeballs on the bridge of the Princeton. Gary Borhes also witnessed them at one point through the big eyes during a different time. He and I are pretty sure that I was on watch at the same time, but I didn't, we didn't cross paths when he came up to use the big eyes. (06:24) I'm sorry, I think I lost a little bit of connection. Can you just repeat the last sentence? Sure, I was talking about the fact that Gary Borhes also witnessed the the tic-tacs and the lights, the tic-tacs in the sky. He had come up to the bridge and he had witnessed them through the big eyes. I was just mentioning that he and I have discussed this too and we think that we were both that this was while I was on watch, but he and I didn't cross paths when he came up to the bridge. (06:52) So I wanted to take a step back from the off-road origin concept for a moment for these objects. Given the statement on the 100 to a thousand year ahead tech, has that in your opinion discounted the possibility of them being a result of foreign adversary, technology or experimental US military assets? Well, I think that we need to make sure that we focus on something specific when we're trying to talk about the subject because we're talking about generally a 70 year investigation that to me spans a wide spectrum of events. (07:26) So if someone says, are they this or are they that? My answer is always going to be probably not. And I don't know because it's such a wide spectrum of things. It would be silly to make a binary choice like that. However, I think what people are asking is do I think some of the things that we have seen might they be our enemies or our near-pure adversaries or other groups of humans and with human technology spoofing us? That is possible. (07:53) That is completely a possibility and we need to be able to train our military and our first responders to be able to determine the difference between those two things. The day after you saw the objects, you were able to watch a segment of the now released footage of the UAP. In your opinion, has the most compelling section of footage been held back from public release? From me, no, I have never saw anything that has been held back from the public. (08:24) The small file that was squirted over to the Princeton via the Sipernet was basically exactly the same as the longer one that we all saw that was a little bit over a minute long. It was just scaled down in quality a little bit so it could be emailed. And what they had done also was they had clipped out the phase changes. (08:44) Each time the craft did something different, they had an equal amount of time of each of those things. So it was kind of a condensed version, but I wouldn't say that anything has been held back. Also, in your opinion, have you seen the smoking gun evidence not yet seen by the public? This, which really tips the scales in your perception that what was buzzing the carrier strike group has no off-world origin? Has an off-world origin? I'd hesitate to say off-world, just a minute. (09:17) I'd hesitate to say off-world because we don't know the origin. But I'm happy to say probably non-human. Or let me put it this way. When I say non-human, I'm saying this is not a person that has an email address and pays taxes and has a normal life that I think you and I would understand. (09:40) While I'm not trying to play it safe or anything like that. The defense intelligence or the defense, the DIRDs, let me say, that came out of ATIP, the research documents. And a lot of people like to write those off because they don't see conclusions that tell them what they want to hear. But what they do give us is a very good picture of what we're seeing. (10:03) And we don't currently possess anti-gravity technology or stealth capability at that level or the ability to cancel inertia or travel at hypersonic velocity, etc. So then if you could be a little bit more specific, what do you think that it could be? If you had to put it in words? Well, we live in a big universe and I think what Chris Mellon said the other night on CNN was apropos. (10:33) It would not surprise me the least if another civilization out there found us before we found them. It wouldn't surprise me if the techno signatures that we are so sure we're going to see all across the galaxy if it's full of other civilizations. We may be wrong. Maybe we're the only ones who use radio or things like that. (10:54) There's a whole plethora of explanations when we start talking about what we would call aliens. Then you have the idea of a breakaway human civilization, someone that's leapfrog the rest of us, perhaps a group of technologically based conglomerate of companies or something like that. And then others have thrown about ideas of multidimensionals and even ultra-terrestrials and other species that might inhabit the planet with us that might be more advanced. (11:22) Perhaps out in the ocean that takes up two-thirds of the planet. I think that covers the whole spectrum in general. Have you personally considered the interdimensional aspect? I have. I've spent a lot of time thinking about all of them and trying to find patterns and trying to find things that fit. And that's why you'll hear me so often say that I believe that this is what we call a phenomenon is a spectrum of different events that we tend to lump under one umbrella. (11:52) Let's backtrack a little bit. When you were on the bridge of the Princeton and the Nimitz officers contacted you about the strange contacts. Did they relay any specific descriptions or details of what you should be looking out for seeing as they wanted you to get eyes on the objects? I was taking most of my direction from senior chief day in the combat information center, but his department head lieutenant commander Teresa Elders, the operations officer had been in communication with her counterpart on board the USS Nimitz. (12:24) And they as was evident in the email chain. Excuse me. That was attached to the video that we all received. You were able to see over the course of the week how they had utilized their education, their acumen, and their skills to try to think about everything this could have been. So they were talking about temperature and versions. They talked about flocks of seagulls. They talked about balloons. (12:47) They talked about all kinds of different things inside of these emails while they while a team of people on both ships was trying to figure out what we were looking at. And when this was happening and when you had read those emails, did you believe those? Oh, well, certainly. I mean, these were people I worked with every day. (13:06) This was a battle group that I had done numerous exercises within. I understood the inner workings of the carrier strike group and the squadrons that were attached to it. I was a bridge officer standing officer, or a junior officer, the deck and conning officer. So I was familiar with how things were communicated back and forth. And by that time I had also stood what's called an under instruction watch for quite a few hours on a console called SWIC. (13:32) I don't remember what it's called, but it was down in the combat information center. And what that does is it gives a surface warrior as we call ourselves in that portion of the Navy. And it gives them a much better picture of how the ship fights, we call it fighting the ship. It's how the ship fights itself, how it fights war. (13:52) And so I had never seen anything like this. No one I worked with had ever seen anything like this. A couple of guys were smugged and they were like, yeah, that's some advanced DARPA project. A lot of guys were saying it was UFOs, a lot of people were saying they knew they knew where the UFOs were from. It's not too much different than it is on UFO Twitter any given day. (14:15) God love everybody, but you can't line up 10 folks and get the same story about where they're from, what they mean, what they're driving, how they're powered. Have you an idea of an estimation of how many other witnesses had eyes on the same object that you saw, either on the Princeton or on other vessels in the group? You know, I never did get around to asking the starboard side watch if they had seen it. (14:43) I expected all of my watch standards to report back to me. So the fact that nobody did, I'm sure I asked a few times on the mic, I don't recall it, but I would have gotten negative responses or else I would have remembered. So I don't know who else saw what I saw at that moment besides the port side watch standard, but I do know that Gary Voorhees, Pety Officer Gary Voorhees said that he saw the contacts on the same vector that the radar was showing he had went up and looked and they were there. (15:15) Commander Fraver, his wingman pilot, I believe that's Lieutenant Commander Dietrich. Yeah, as well as, yeah, those were the only people I can't remember the pilot who recorded it, unfortunately, his name always escapes me. But the people that you did ask and maybe you know response or negative response, do you think it was because they really didn't see the object or maybe because they were trying to avoid ridicule? No, I think they would have said so. We were just looking for contacts. We weren't looking for UFOs or aliens or anything. So T-Rick, we were looking for contacts. We the contacts, most contacts, if you see them, they're either non-luminous or luminous. (15:59) So these happen to be luminous. Even an aircraft at distance depending upon its lighting configuration can be a luminous object, a metal object can take a reflection from the sun and be very luminous. Silver Mylar balloons are something we're completely accustomed to out in that area of the ocean pilots and mariners are completely accustomed to all manner of balloons floating out to sea. So we see those all the time. (16:29) X-Fowa says, I hope I said that right, too. Great show. Hashawn ever looked into the military's experiments with remote viewing and their claims of finding various alien bases around the world? I have. I've read most of the unclassified data that I could find and frankly most of the books from the people that served at Army Fort Mead and the Stanford Research Institute and various other peripheral programs. I find a lot of the data very compelling. (17:00) Like other people, any story by another person if you can't verify the data yourself, it's just that. But I find the data and frankly the phenomena of remote viewing to be something that's very compelling. Yeah, it is and it's amazing how it's been studied for quite some time and even has their own school for and even been funded by the CIA. I think it was in the 70s or the 70s, right? So that's really interesting. (17:34) Is something that you've practiced? I've given it a try. I'm a meditator. I was a meditation facilitator/teacher for a little while. So it's something to naturally try. There's interesting things that occur at the boundary between the boundary of consciousness between awake and asleep. If you were able to maintain your consciousness in that area, there's a lot of interesting things that occur. I don't bet my rent money on it. And I don't change my the course of my life based on it, but I find it to be very compelling. (18:12) You just previous to this question, you just mentioned balloons and sequels. What do you think of the certain skeptic hypotheses that all of these things can be chalked up to be sequels and balloons? I don't give it any any daytime. I don't give it any of my my effort. It's a very faseal explanation that it's frankly it just speaks more of the psychology of the debunker than of the event itself. (18:42) Were you made aware at the time that the objects were also being tracked as solid targets on the twin stins radar? Yes, one of the first things that Kevin had told me was that I wouldn't believe what they were seeing on the radar that these things were popping in at suborbital altitude and then they were immediately dropping down to the deck right above the water in a fraction of a second, almost instantaneously. (19:08) And then stopping on a dime was was what Kevin had said and it was we were all incredulous to that. I mean we were we were going to find this if it was real, but none of us could none of us believed that we were going to find anything. So when we did start finding solid returns and when the radar tax and senior chief day and other folks were telling us know these look solid let's let's see and see if they asked the captain to if we could send out a story of of f eight teens. (19:41) And for those I'm sorry for those that might not know what f eight teens are can you just briefly explain that. And I believe it's the main compliment of the United States Navy on board our aircraft carriers for a fixed wing aircraft. We launch via launch and recover via catapult and arresting wire and we have launch capability on a five minute notice at any given time. (20:16) And during this time in 2004 without one of the most advanced technologies that you had at the time or was it absolutely the radar on board the f eight the f eight teen hornet as well as the the ages radar on board the US Princeton that had just been upgraded where the most advanced radars in the world at the time. (20:37) Wow was there to your recollection sorry excuse me was there to your recollection a moment when other bridge officers on the Princeton or other vessels in the group made it known that the objects could represent a security threat significant enough to warrant a change of alert level or was this something that you heard being debated. (21:01) There's no time that we discussed the tic tac or the or the tic tac plural being a threat. At no point where they would I say that they were harassing our assets in any way they seem to be sharing our operating area and going about their business on their own I believe senior cheap day and commander fraver said had had they inclined toward it seeming to be in a loof technology. (21:30) You mentioned in your interview with Louis on the TV show unidentified inside America's UFO investigation that you had a subsequent meeting and PowerPoint presentation about general items that do with operations and that the only mention of the UFO was a silly animation it was just then brushed off as a non item. (21:52) Did you leave that meeting thinking that it was done that way to be delegitimized and deter any further mentions of the encounter or rather that nobody had a real clue on how to address the topic being so fringe in nature. Actually I have an option C because I took a lot of cues from my captain that night he was a very senior O6 in the Navy in fact this was his last tour before retire or actually he had one more twilight tour perhaps but he was quite senior and quite respected. (22:23) And I had been trained in interview and interrogation and other things like that and I was looking at someone who was completely unconcerned with these events and when he blew it off and made a little joke about it I didn't feel looking back there was nothing I wouldn't call it stigmatizing so much I mean I think we all kind of felt the same way it was nice to let the steam off if we weren't going to get an answer it was nice to just kind of blow it off and move on. (22:48) But the way that he reacted I thought this must have been an advanced project of art or black project or DARPA or something like that. In your interview with you with the will is on the TV show you also mentioned that later you put yourself in a mindset of pretending that the whole thing didn't mean anything and didn't really happen during that time where you approached by others who witnessed it and felt the same way as you. (23:16) I wouldn't I wouldn't phrase it quite that I was pretending I truly believed it was it was it had prosaic explanations and it wasn't other worldly technology or whatever until 2017. No one else it ever approached me about that incident while the only person that did I discussed them before and some other podcast it was two weeks after the incident when I returned I went back to my old police station to steal some caution tape. (23:45) And just talk to the guys and when I walked in one of my guys had pulled me aside and he said hey chief can I talk to you can we go have a cigarette and I thought that was strange at the time I smoked and he didn't and he was very anti against it so I kind of squinted and said sure and went with him and I was kind of like what's all and he actually took one and everything and I was like what's going on here and he goes hey did you guys see anything weird when you guys were out there on the Princeton. (24:11) Recently and I was like yeah man we did why and he said that well his he's he said that his wife had witnessed the Nimitz master at arms force guarding pilots in their state rooms until folks landed on board in in plain clothes for to debrief the pilots. So I still don't know if that's true or not that's that's third party that's one of the first things I reported to Lou so I don't know if those are the folks that eventually came and took the radar tapes or or who they were or even if it triangulates act accurately but that was the only other person that ever approached me about the incident while. (24:59) High strangeness stranger asks is it possible take tax or bulk project tech that would be a savings bulk black project oh yeah that's what I thought back then. But looking back and having having read the durs and having talked to Lou for a few years there's no way that technology was us and it wasn't. (25:26) It wasn't China it wasn't Russia that that's my opinion but I'm going to stand pretty firm on that if that turns out to be our tech I'm going to be one of the first people to go I was absolutely wrong and I'm going to have I'm going to have mud on my face. Moose one nine one one has a question he says how many times our targets picked up but no one can visually verify them I am curious how often that happened keep doing great work Christina and Sean thank you. (25:55) I would say that it happens often but the thing is that a lot of times I think that you're going to have a person. Manning for lack of a better word or radar scope and they're going to be seeing something now whether they're going to be able to have an observer in place to look on the same vector and try to see that the two things don't always come together you know you might be an inclement weather or you could have a low cloud cover. (26:20) If we're talking about a air traffic controller for commercial air you know he doesn't have a team of observers I was lucky enough to at least have have one two three four five six folks or so that I could call on on sound powered phones and order them to look in a specific direction that's a very unusual set of circumstances to have that equipment that person directing it and a team of people ready to do that so. (26:49) In the assuming 11 years of active service even though you tried to mentally put the encounter out of your mind did you learn anything more about the events or here of similar events with other vessels and if so are you able to share with us some details. I dove into coast to coast I am with with art bell I dove into the website above top secret I was a perific poster for about a year I was quite the skeptic many of the people that I enjoy friends enjoy friendships with today and have quite a bit of respect for I was quite critical of them at the time. (27:31) It's it's been a strange intervening time I was very much in the period between the tic tac and the 2017 New York Times article and meeting Lou in between there I become an atheist I stopped believing in anything magical, esoteric, wonderful wacky out there anything. And became a sour push for like a better word. (28:05) That that I went through a lot to get away from that later on you know after I retired I had I frankly I had a hard time transitioning when I took off my uniform and didn't have my anchors on my collar anymore I lost a lot of my identity and I lost a lot of my confidence and so I had to do a little bit of personal rebuilding the meditation and. (28:27) And you know introspection and even a little bit of cognitive therapy nobody should ever be afraid to ask for help go talk to somebody else but i'm 2017 was it was a kick in the gut. I walked in the house and looked at my wife and holding this the computer and just was like holy s that that stuff back in the old four was real. (28:51) Now her little account her face you know exactly what I meant when I said real I meant that it wasn't some cool air for stuff. Tim E has a question on a comment that you had mentioned earlier and he says what type of energy is admitted from these craft that can cause disability is it energy we know and use or know is the type of fuel or propulsion known or have a guess. (29:19) As far as the type of energy admitted I believe that i'm not a scientist by trade I'm also don't have an education that would would make me someone who's. We should be getting these answers from but I believe that most of the defense reports that I've seen or not that shouldn't say defense reports I should just say reports in general because I'm mixing a lot of civilian data with with other things. (29:41) But I do believe that they are radiating sometimes in the gamma range which is a very high radiative radiative radiative frequency that can you can be exposed to that when you're around nuclear and fissionable materials. It doesn't necessarily indicate what their propulsion system is it would seem that that's a byproduct of it we only know. (30:06) A certain list of things that we are able to produce gamma rays with but it would yeah that's what that would all be speculation beyond that I have no clue what's in their gas tank to be honest with you. What do you think the tick tax were actually doing based on your military experience recon exercises the object underwater that favor saw. (30:30) That's an excellent insight my opinion based on what we what we what was witnessed and what we put together after the fact it would seem to me that the tick tax were tender vehicles to something larger in the water or they were observing something in the water now I know that the that area of the waters often described as seven 47 in size of a seven 47. (30:56) I've never heard it described as the shape of a seven 47 I think it leads a lot of a lot of us to think that it's a elongated shape I believe the commander favor is described the water was roiling so my praseic explanation for that was it was a school of sardines and that's what the tick tax were checking out because when Lou and I went down to ansonata we interviewed pilots and fishermen who talked about spotting those very same groups of sardines for fishermen you know the spotter planes would then lead them back out. (31:25) So is that a possibility so totally could it have been something a larger craft that they were tending to we've got lots of reports over the sepiers to say that smaller tender craft seem to go and company with larger craft so I think that's again that's the spectrum of possibility there for me. (31:51) Brendan has a question and he says I just wanted to say I appreciate what you both are doing Sean would you agree Rubio Harry Reid and others stating the phenomenon could be from an adversial country is most likely so the subject continues to game momentum. I think that people like senator Rubio and former senator Reid make those statements because we pardon me for saying it like this but we live in a real world and that has rules that the rest of us apply to our daily lives and for most of us UFOs aren't on that aren't in that rule set yet. (32:27) So I do think it's number one they have to come at it from a prosaic provable standpoint no one has proven the origin of these these are unidentified aucomes razor would say it's another country that it's humans etc because we still again none of us have evidence to bring out for the seven billion people on this planet to convince them all that these are aliens are these or whatever. (32:50) Someone's beliefs are so I think they go with the most likely explanation according to what we all know. So kind of like fitting into our ideologies. And that's the best estimate we have I mean if I know a lot of people have assumptions they think the government must have this and they must have that and I heard this and I read that book I don't know and I'm not I can't stand up here and say that we do or do not have these things. (33:19) But I guess what I'm trying to say is that the people people that that that inform us our our government our media etc we all know that if they started talking about aliens and flying saucers and couldn't show us one and have have our elected representatives walk up and touch it and see it none of us are going to believe that either. (33:47) This is true I mean what we're definitely you know if you see it right if you don't see it you don't believe it if you see it you believe it. Yeah. So let's change gears the experience obviously play seeds within of your curiosity and of a shifting of your paradigm which in recent years as more people have come out and talked about the incident and also with so many so much being released and validated on the topic in general by the government has allowed you to follow a different path. (34:16) In pursuing truth not only about UFOs but about the bigger questions of life consciousness and alternate living can you describe how that process has been for you like how much your paradigm has shifted. Wow. I don't think it's I don't think it's just my generation but I'll speak from you know about to be 50 something JenExer. (34:43) The movie the the matrix blew my mind and it took a long time after that to really kind of assimilate the ideas that were in it and to learn where the I think is the Wachowskies where they where they really where they went for their inspiration in that story. I'm not a conspiracy theorist I'm having been in law enforcement and anti terrorism investigations etc. I'm quite aware that a conspiracy is just a couple of folks deciding to pull one over on somebody else it's not that big of a deal there's conspiracies all around every day. (35:18) I have a conspiracy to pick the restaurant for dinner later tonight you know with someone else so we don't go where I don't want to. But at the same time we've seen so many changes in the subject we've seen so much openness that it's open my mind to so many different possibilities. (35:39) My my personal interactions with my own consciousness in meditation while fasting and things that might be foreign to a lot of other people have taught me that how I defined myself. In years past is quite different than how I intend to define myself going forward and my duty to the people around me so I like to think that this is a subject that it really opens people's minds it just it can't exist in the same space that our old ways of thinking did. (36:14) So we're going to have to open our minds to new ways of thinking to wrap our heads around why some folks see this why some folks don't why some feel like it's interacting very personally with them why other people feel like it's acting interacting with them in a negative fashion there's a lot of parts of this that none of us like to talk about because they're the yucky parts. (36:35) And some day we're going to have to get there and we're going to have to talk about those and talk about the mental health aspects and where that bumps into the phenomenon and where the phenomenon is causing mental health aspects whether negative or positive so there's so much to it and right now we have to focus on on the every day nuts and both stuff because that's what's going to keep people's attention and I think that's about all that we can prove to each other right now. (37:03) So you're very much in touch with others who like yourself have had unexpected encounters with this phenomenon both in active service in the past and now obviously outside of armed services is this paradigm shift something you have observed and shared with others. It is this is about all I talk about it's about all I do my family has been really kind to me and supportive it took a long time for it to be any I wouldn't say an easy topic in the house. (37:39) But one that we just expect every day to hear more and more UFO crap as we say you know since it's it's our job here in the house it's obviously we don't that's not how I think about it it's incredibly important to me because I've dedicated my life to it but I have seen a huge shift I have seen an incredible shift just within the last few weeks and even in the last few days. (38:00) I don't like getting hopes up too much because one of the parts about being a human is realizing that having our expectations dashed is one of the most painful things we can ever experience besides shame. But I dare say we're doing it I dare say we've moved the mountain we've changed the conversation and all of these other things that people are just so excited and so frankly desperate to start talking about with other people. (38:27) I think we're going to start seeing that that damn open and that that river start flowing for everybody. You are now a self describe you a P awareness activist can you tell us how you are going up about pushing that awareness how you are involved with the quest for more official transparency in the phenomenon. (38:51) Yes a lot of people who knew me to be daily on Twitter and writing a lot of articles and producing content for YouTube or other things like that have noticed that I'm I'm not as I'm not out there as much anymore. That's because I've formed a team with a couple of colleagues of mine to help support Lou. (39:11) We're not we're not completely public yet but we've been able to assist Luis and and Christopher melon and a few other people with getting into some really influential spots and getting to talk to some people. And that includes members of the press we've given briefings for and I want I want people to understand there's nothing about these briefings that are secret or special you're not getting left out of anything it's the same kind of thing that you're going to that everybody on UFO Twitter already knows all about. (39:40) But we've been able to kind of pull out on the freeway around the stigma because of Luis's gravitas and and Chris's background and and really go hey let us get 10 minutes of your time and if at the end of this you know you think it's not worthwhile then then that's it and we haven't had any we've had practically no one turn us down. (40:07) So I mean, there's like a well known noted debunker and skeptic who is world famous and that's probably a list of five or six people so nobody's going to guess it but he frankly was like a hell no I want nothing to do with you. How do you how do you balance your meditative life and spiritual pursuits with your efforts for UAP awareness activism or do you feel they are sinner synergistic with each other. (40:41) I have found that frankly the core values that come with my meditative practice which are are they're just basically really steeped in compassion forgiveness and self awareness. I think they translate perfectly to the subject because it is such an emotional subject. I've never met anyone who had a strong opinion about it that didn't have a strong set of emotions that went with it. (41:07) A lot of people that have experienced seem to have experienced this phenomena have trauma that goes along with it admitting to trauma understanding its effects and understanding that practically every single one of us is experienced at some point or another in our life and that it's helped mold our actions from that point out. (41:26) Even knowing that is beyond a lot of folks and that's not to say that they're not sophisticated it's just to say that they haven't gotten there yet in that self awareness piece. So for me a day of UAP awareness activism starts and finishes with meditation frankly because I have to know who I am when I begin the day and when I end the day. (41:49) And I know myself by by calming paying attention to my breath sometimes using a mantra but basically dropping into what a lot of meditators call heart space and it's a very peaceful place where you kind of forget that your shan or Christina for a minute. And you kind of remember that we're each other and that we're everybody now a lot of people are going to call me a hippie for that. (42:12) And I get it and a lot but those same folks are going to tell you that they can't sit in a room alone with their own thoughts for 10 minutes because it'll drive them crazy and I get that too because I used to be that person so for me. It really just comes down to compassion because this is too important of a subject to every single person involved to play with it. (42:33) And how long have you been meditating for? Six years now? Five years, six years? I'm not sure. I don't really keep track like that but yeah five or six years. And do you think it was a slow progression or it was pretty quick in seeing the improvements? I was one of those people who who had really fast. (43:01) I don't want to say results because meditation should never be results oriented but we're humans and we need we need check blocks or wickets or you know. So it I had some pretty awesome experiences in the beginning. I don't like talking about them. I think most. You dedicated meditators don't talk too much about what occurs on the interior. It's best that we find out on our own but it was real hard at first and then some really awesome stuff happened and then it got real hard again and then it's been pretty easy sense. (43:39) High strangeness stranger has a question he says if ship based radar systems can be picked can pick these up. Have you heard if we can track these through ages or bad missile defense systems? Everything that I've seen and I'm not the authority on this but everything I've seen has said that there seems to be a pattern with us having flaps as we say you know UFO flaps with the military in regards to radar upgrades. (44:12) I could be wrong about that but it looks like that's what happened to us in 04 with the tick tack it looks like that's what happened in 2015 with Roosevelt and the f18s. Excuse me that we're out there. So I hazard that as our technology is reached out more into the electromagnetic spectrum as we've as our sensor suites sample more and more of the reality around us that we don't see with our with our regular eyes and senses. (44:41) It appears to me in my opinion I don't know if this is true or not but it would appear to me that we are that we keep catching up to the phenomenon on its edges and that perhaps it might be adjusting its paradigm to not be detected after that but that's a lot of speculation on my point or on my part rather. (45:02) Carl by has a question he says does he I'm assuming you feel the phenomenon could communicate with meditation and telepathic contact and has himself has himself anyone he knows reported such contact in his experiences. That's a question that I've been asked a lot I provided my opinion on contact meditation before and told people that I think they should be careful for me that has more to do with a person's personal psychological well being I don't think everybody should be trying to do that because frankly I don't know what it would be like for a nonmeditator to try to go through that process and what it would be like for them to to get feedback let's just say that. (45:51) Because I don't know the origin of the feedback but a lot of people seem to assume that what is occurring in consciousness for them is other entities. I'm not going to start naming them I don't want to ruffle any feathers but let's say folks think they're talking to other people some people think that what they see in the sky. (46:15) Sometimes when they're doing that are UFOs and aliens that are talking to them telepathically. Is it possible? Yeah I totally think it's possible. I think that my personal experience is that we live in a very dynamic universe that the human psyche and what we call consciousness is a very dynamic and large environment and system that we don't really understand we're just living in it. (46:43) So is it possible? Sure. But we still don't have anybody that's got some nice clear video and has a land you know it look I've been contacted in the last couple of years by a handful of people who made very clear to me that they could provide evidence that if I would come to them with my camera and detection equipment that they were sure and that they thought I had a good heart and they thought I would be a good person to do this. (47:11) And I took them at their word and each time I was BSed completely you know it wasn't just a set of nice folks who had a bad night meditating. We didn't even we never got down to business. So it's a rough subject for me. I know that there are other people that have that have hoaxed folks. There's a lot of people out there that make money taking people on UFO tours and I'm sorry I've looked up plenty of these folks. They're pointing out satellites they're pointing out you know we know where the Torrid meteor storm is seasonally we know we're all if you don't know anything about the sky and someone takes you out to the desert I could probably convince you in one night that we were surrounded by craziness. (47:56) So I think we have to point out the charlatans I think we have to look at the peer review data I think we as much as we've been forced in in the what people call ufology to rely on anecdotal data and data within the community itself we have to break this out into the daylight and get real peer reviewed answers I know that's going to be tough. (48:19) So Sean field of military has ever used or assets as bait to try and attract these things for study slash data. I would I would remove the word military and as much as I am not fond of calling our government and you know in the government or an edifice. I would say yes I feel that the government in some fashion has has done research to try to bait the phenomena. (48:49) And one more question here it says do you loosen dream or do you believe meditation gives some answers. I have to be true to myself I even though I might turn some folks off the short answers yes the long answer is that I believe that when we meditate I believe that we're able to tap into something that is beyond us it's given me a great hope for who we are what we are and what all of this is around us. (49:20) But as I'm an artist I paint I write I play quite a few instruments and when I do those things I surrender a piece of myself to the same place that I go when I meditate. And the beauty of the art that comes out is completely different completely different quality than what I was able to produce when I was trying to force it. (49:44) If folks are familiar with Charles Bukowski you'll understand what forcing it means. Could you briefly describe who that is. Charles Bukowski was a prolific writer a poet but he was also a horrific alcoholic and he had a horrible view about creativity in my opinion. George says I knew he sang it's in his voice. (50:13) Thank you. We're going to continue now for my patrons of borders for QA on everything from skinwalker to exoplanets so sign up. Thank you to my patrons. And now bonus content of questions and answers previously only available to patreon club members. You mentioned skinwalker ranch so I'm really interested to hear your thoughts and insights on what is going on there and how much you think it might have to do with the objects you observe on the Princeton. (50:48) Interesting. The direct connections hard to draw for me. But there have been numerous sightings of what we would call you a P at skinwalker ranch over the years on and off the record in in myth and lore and even in some of the reports that that seem to come out of us out. And I think it's a big, a big, a low aerospace. (51:26) It's a very interesting property. I like to take the I like it when we I shouldn't say I like it. I'm very interested when I find a portion of the phenomenon that has a modern day. And I think the ideal of lore behind it, especially when that is with an indigenous group of people who've maintained an oral tradition. (51:45) So I find what they have to say very interesting when coupled with the defense reports beyond this it becomes complete speculation the people we'd want to speak to or are people like calm Keller and other folks that were involved with big, a low aerospace at the time. The same thing is that the action app is obviously an expert on the subject. But there seems to be a different way that energy manifests itself. There seems to be in some ways a different way that time flows. (52:16) There seems to be, you know, what we call the phenomena, whether we're talking about individuals moving within a realm. We don't understand that touches matter within the one that we live in. There's also so much so much strangeness comes out of that place that if I were to speculate or write a science fiction novel about it, it sounds like there's almost a rotating door of a portal of some kind there that has such a roulette type effect. (52:46) Either that there's some people that speculate in a more more of a valet type theoretical slant that what we're seeing is a control system that is perhaps breaking down at that specific location on the earth and that we're seeing quantum effects that while they appear a certain way to us may not have the meaning that we seek, you know, kind of a Schrodinger's cat effect, the if you're familiar with Schrodinger's cat, the cats neither alive nor dead until the tell you open the box and find out what the state of the isotope is. (53:28) So perhaps sometimes when we see through this crack in our reality, it's anybody's guess what we're going to get back. When those tic-tac objects you saw on the prints and disappeared, did they blink out like they shut off their lights or do you feel they literally warped out of the atmosphere or even shifted their frequency into another dimension? What is your opinion? Well, I think we're all really informed by a lot of the science fiction movies we've seen. (53:56) So I think we know what we're talking about when we say warped in a classic sense, they just blinked out. When I say blinked, it's the same as if you were to blink your eyes and an object that was there a moment ago is just no longer there. There was no effect to be seen. I can't really speculate on where they went after that. I think where they went, I don't mean to joke, but it was to Commander Freyver's cat point. Obviously it would not. They wasn't at the same time. (54:25) But I think that that's, I can't say that they're going anywhere that isn't here. They could be translating from one place to another so fast that we just make an assumption that they're doing that. Again, I think a lot of the speculation comes from we make assumptions based on what we know from science fiction, we make assumptions based on what we've seen in in in in scientific literature about things like the alkyberry drive and modern warp drive technology and we try to apply it to what we've seen. (55:01) Based on the defense intelligence reports and we do get something that I think at some level is going to touch on esoteric physics. So is it going in via another dimension? Is it creating a wormhole? Is it bending space time? Is it moving along through our reality at a frame rate that we're not able to perceive properly? There's a lot of different possibilities. (55:31) You mentioned that you have been invited to witness UFOs and it had been just a waste of your time. But have you ever just gone off on your own, maybe on a road trip to some hotspot to see if you can see these things again? And if so, where? Yes, I have. I've spent time, well, we spent time down around Wattaloupa Island for the history channel show and we had some interesting sighting and interesting sighting down there. (56:00) I've also been out to some specific places out at Joshua Tree and I've had some interesting sightings out there and some interesting, not your run of the mill meditative experience. Let's just put it that way. Nothing that I could bring back to anybody is definitive proof of anything, but I'm familiar with what the folks are asking about. (56:22) Well, I'm aware of west of Sedona being the UFO hotspot and there's a strange range called Brasjal Ranch west of Sedona too. And it's kind of like a mirror of skin walker ranch. It has changed hands many times and the government has been involved in buyouts and it has all kind of under the same phenomenon that has been described at skin walker ranch. (56:44) Have you ever been to Sedona or to do sky watches there? I've spent a little bit of time in Sedona. It's a place that I enjoy quite a bit. I haven't, believe it or not, though, for all the visits I've had there, I've never done anything more spiritual than go on some tours of some Native American ruins and petroglyphs and things like that. (57:08) I haven't been back since that was something I was more interested in personally. It's something that I would like to do. I have a lot of plans when I have the time and the resources to do a little bit more personal or excuse me exploration. I've been asked to give my opinion on so many things in the last couple years, but as far as having the time to actually really apply myself to some of the more. (57:37) I think fringe parts of this because frankly somebody does have to check them out and report back to the rest of us. I haven't had the time lately, so I look forward to getting back to that. You also mentioned earlier that you were asked to bring special detection equipment to those who invited you to UFO sighting events. (57:55) What equipment do you use for sky watching? Well, when I say special, I guess I'm saying just something not everybody's going to have in their back pocket like an iPhone, but some fleer equipment, some different, some infrared, some low light technology stuff. Let's see, try field meters, just basically anything that we could bring with us to literally to even include an FM radio and an AM radio to sample the spectrum. (58:25) We also, when we were going out, we had military grade night vision with GoPro's attached. And we had, you know, keep personnel that were dedicated with lasers to, and I'm very careful when I talk about using lasers with things in the sky. You don't, you don't, lays things in the sky. I don't care what you think they are. You never, you blind that pilot. You could kill a whole lot of people. Never do that. (58:47) You may lays in the vicinity, but never at the object itself. Besides, if you don't hurt anybody, the FAA will still come after you. But the short answer is just try to sample the spectrum as much as you can. If you have an internet connection, you should know what satellites are in the sky over you, what regions of the sky are hosting a meteor shower or at the time. (59:12) You should have flight radar 24 or some app like that telling you what aircraft is in the sky. You should know the generalized flight paths of the military aircraft, etc. And you should understand lighting patterns of aircraft. You should be able to call all of that stuff out easily. You should never be fooled. (59:30) So the moment that you see something weird and, you know, your hands are shaken and you barely hold in the camera well, you know, you know that you see something weird. What other things are you interested in out of the normal and aside from us, so is UFOs in the realm of the paranormal and the supernatural? Well, I'm obviously most interested in human consciousness. Who we are, how we approach life, how we weather our challenges, how we let feelings occur in our body and how we translate them and then emote them to other people. (1:00:09) I'm really fascinated by how we operate and why beyond that indigenous culture, myth and even historical religion, all of those things. To me, they just form a beautiful tapestry that's our reality. They'll speak to us a little bit about who we are on a larger level, not just the current society that we're living in, but maybe what we are as a collective. (1:00:42) Those things, those things fascinate me. And peeling back the layers of who we are and what our reality is. And expanding ourselves. Those are the things that interest me the most. Where would you like to see the disclosure process in a year's time? And where do you think it'll be realistically speaking? Honestly, I think that I think we're going to get what I want. I think we're going to get a curriculum that's going to exist in the public eye in an unclassified fashion if we keep working. (1:01:17) I think that we're going to get governmental oversight in a way that gives the populist confidence in an issue while also having executive oversight over those programs so that they don't get out of hand as perhaps things in the past did. I also look forward to a time when when academia is going to step up and say we've seen the data, we understand that there's more work to be done. (1:01:46) We're going to take this seriously and it becomes a curriculum. So I think we're seeing the beginnings of that. So a year from now, I hope that we see that the permanency that I truly hope for. Are there any interesting projects you're working on with Luela Zondo now to help push this topic forward that you're able to speak of? I dare say that we have our hands. I don't want to say in a lot of pies right now, but we have we are reaching out in every way, shape or fashion to competent, rational thinking individuals who I don't like using the word influencer, (1:02:25) but frankly, that's who these people are. They're people who influence the larger zeitgeist and society. We don't have an agenda. We just want to get them in front of us for a minute and say, hey, this is serious. Here's the data. Here's where it's been reported recently. A lot of folks need to play catch up, not everybody is a Russell brand or a Demi Lovato, not everyone is paying attention to the subject, but a lot of the people that influence us and that are our campfire storytellers for our society. (1:02:58) I think once they understand the reality of this in a lot of ways, we folks like Lu and I get to take our hands off the wheel to an extent. We can get back to what we're good at doing, which is helping figure out the military or governmental side of this. If I can add real quick to that, I think what a lot of folks are missing when we talk about the possibility of these things being a threat. (1:03:23) Again, you're going to see the only people that say that are selling a threat narrative are literally selling tickets to nonsense. So, Lu and I aren't interested in a threat narrative. We are interested in the fact that there are things in our local neighborhood and as military men, we don't feel like we can if these were to be a threat. (1:03:43) We don't believe that we're currently able to protect our population from them. So, that just means we'd like to have at least the same length of stick that the guy walking down the path towards us has to, if that makes sense. And we want to make sure that we're protected and we understand what's going on. (1:04:01) But I think you'll see that with all of these things that have gone on recently that we're hearing about, the things that were released via Jeremy Corbell, some of those videos, etc, they're showing that whatever is occurring, our military is not going off half cocked and spraying 50 cal rounds at these things and blowing them out of the sky. (1:04:21) So, I don't think anybody in the military or surrounding it has a lot more patience left for these people who talk about us coming out here with a threat narrative. Man, find me talking about a threat narrative. I dare you. Thank you so much, Sean, for joining me today on these exclusive Q&A questions for the Patreon supporters. (1:04:42)